Single Leg attachment suggestions

[farmerbw]

I'm making a couple of fairly simple portable tables from some free plans that I'm going to enlarge and think I need to deviate from their suggested mounting hardware and am not sure what I should use.

The top is just a 3/4x11 3/4x19 1/2 ERC plank that will have some holes and slots to hold wine glasses. I'm going to use a small diameter trunk section of Cedar as the single leg. The plans call for a premade table leg to be attached by using a straight top mounting plate which attaches to the bottom of the plank via 4 screws. I'm making them to be used on the beach so they'll be exposed to some moisture and salt air so I'm guessing I probably should use stainless hardware but I'm not sure I'll be able to locate the plate they use in stainless.

I was thinking of going with 5/16 hanger bolts and matching T-nuts in stainless but thought I'd see if anyone else could offer any better solutions and maybe a local source since I'm pressed for time on getting the hardware. WoodCraft doesn't carry stainless and I'm going to try Klingspor tomorrow but I'm not hopeful. I think McFeely's carries them but need to go over to their site and double check.

TIA.

 

[Jeff]

Brian,

Could you post a quick sketch or pic which shows the leg attachment to the table top? That'd be helpful.

For beach use you should use 316 SS for its superior corrosion resistance. It's only marginally more expensive than the more common 306 or 308 SS. McMaster offers 316 SS plates in a wide selection of thicknesses, lengths, and widths. They also have SS screws, bolts, etc. (many are available in square drive, phillips, torx, etc.).

http://www.mcmaster.com/#

 

[FredP]

description? ok
pictures? priceless!:gar-Bi is the top to be removable? if not you could use dowels and avoid the whole corrosion issue all together. also a wedged tenon would work.

 

[farmerbw]

I know, I know.....pictures!!!!:rotflm::rotflm::rotflm: My new scanner wouldn't cooperate and I was doing too many things at once. Here's a redneck rough sketch and a picture of what it would look like if I painted it, which I'm not.

Yes the single leg is going to be removable so it's easier to carry to the beach.

Fred, I was actually concerned about the screws holding in the ERC and actually considered gluing up a block and gluing that to the center of the bottom and drilling that to accept the cedar trunk which had been tenoned. I think that would then require a pin/peg of some type through the tenon to keep it from turning and lifting off. Maybe glue/epoxy on the T-nuts or table plate would solve my screw holding problem, or maybe it's really not a problem at all.

Anywho, here's the sketch and pic. btw, I found the plans for this in one of those Lowe's project mailers and just realized they had it online so here's a link to that as well if it will shed more light....

TIA,
Brian.

 

[Mike Davis]

You could tap a screw hole in the top and turn a screw on the leg. No hardware, but need tap and die for wood.

Once you have the tools it would be easy to reproduce more tables cheaply.

 

[ehpoole]

My vote would be the hanger bolt for the leg and a threaded insert for the table (inserts are readily available in brass). Does the same job as a t-nut, but they're permanent and leave you with no loose items to misplace.

 

[farmerbw]

Mike, very interesting idea which I hadn't considered. :eusa_thin

Since my top is only 3/4 do you think I'd need to go with the glued up block to tap for the top? I'm asking mainly cause I'm trying to keep the top as thin as possible so it's easier to fit in a beach bag or the like and a block for attachment would make it a bit unwieldy.

Thanks,
Brian.

 

[farmerbw]

Ethan, I saw brass inserts at WoodCraft and wondered if they would work or how well it would hold in cedar. Do you glue/epoxy those or do they have enough holding power on their own?


Brian.

 

[ehpoole]

In most woods they will hold quite well. If your wood causes you any trouble you can always remove it and epoxy it in place. That said, I have never had to epoxy a threaded insert that has been fully embedded -- I have had to in a few instances where I could only 1/2 seat an insert.

When you purchase your threaded insert, you may also wish to pick up the T-wrench for that size insert. It isn't mandatory -- you can use a long bolt with a pair of nuts locked-up against one another and install it with the bolt and wrench/socket -- but the T-wrench makes the install much simpler, especially if you start incorporating them in other projects.

I use them fairly regularly in projects that need to be disassembled as well as for jigs. The only thing to look out for with them is that they will typically cause the wood to pillow out a bit on the side they were inserted from (caused by the extra thickness of the threads). You can either pre-tap threads to prevent this (they often match standard coarse taps of appropriate diameter), or you can insert it just a little further and follow up with a quick sanding to reflatted the wood surrounding the insert.

 

[FredP]

:widea: glue a support piece to the bottom with a nut inset in it, same as making a face plate for a lathe. basically a disk with a large hole drilled partway through and a smaller hole the rest of the way through. chisel the large hole in a hexagon to hold the nut or just epoxy it in.thread a bolt into the leg and grind the head off. you can epoxy that too if you like. no exposed hardware and removable too.:icon_thum I would not trust the cedar by itself.:nah:

 

[Bas]

DavidF would probably do a tapered sliding dovetail in top, so you can slide the leg into the table. If you're concerned about corrosion, what if you glued a large diameter (3/4"? 1"?) wooden dowel into the leg, and then drilled/ tapped a hole in the top? Same idea as using a bolt/ T-nut, but last time I looked, wood rots, it doesn't rust

Edit: Mike suggested the same thing, need to remember to hit that Submit button right away.... Except my variant doesn't require turning

 

[Canuck]

You could try to use a floor flange like this....

http://www.homedepot.com/Building-M...splay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053

You could use threaded inserts in the table and just "bolt" the flange to the bottom of table. A short section of galvanized threaded pipe as a leg or epoxy a short piece of male threaded pipe into the top of the cedar leg to thread the leg onto the flange.

I have used the flange idea for years on the bird feeders in the yard and they have worked just fine.

Pretty simple and cost effective solution.

Wayne

 

[Mike Davis]

I would drill and tap the hole all the way through the top, use a thread box to make the threads on the leg, make the threads a little too long, screw the leg into the top then plane it level.

 

[bwat]

A wedged tenon should also be sufficient for stability and strength.

 

[jhreed]

I would use a Miller Dowel and glue.
James

 

[Mike Davis]

He wants the leg to be removable, that's why I suggest the wood screw.

 

[farmerbw]

Thanks guys, lots of good ideas to consider.

Fred, do you think cedar would suffice for the support piece or would it require something "harder"? How about using a T-nut or brass insert upside down instead of relying on me cutting out a hexagon that would keep an embedded nut from breaking free and spinning? I guess epoxy would probably solve that problem though so it probably wouldn't be an issue.

Mike, your suggestion still intrigues me the most and I think it would look really cool if I could pull it off.

Thanks,
Brian.

 

[FredP]

Thanks guys, lots of good ideas to consider.

Fred, do you think cedar would suffice for the support piece or would it require something "harder"? How about using a T-nut or brass insert upside down instead of relying on me cutting out a hexagon that would keep an embedded nut from breaking free and spinning? I guess epoxy would probably solve that problem though so it probably wouldn't be an issue.

Mike, your suggestion still intrigues me the most and I think it would look really cool if I could pull it off.

Thanks,
Brian.

I think cedar would be ok if it was 1 1/2" thick total. cedar is very soft and easily splits. I have a wood tap and die set but it only 1/2". not sure that would be strong enough in cedar however you could thread a piece of hard wood dowel and drill the post for it. you would not have to thicken the whole top just a small disk in the middle would be sufficient and run the grain the opposite of the top. this would give you some extra strength at the joint. [threaded hole]

 

[farmerbw]

Fred, I think 1/2 would probably be too small too. However, it looks like the threading kits aren't as expensive as I thought they would be. Think one like this in 1" would give me enough surface area? I would still go with a reinforcement block on the bottom to give me more thread depth cause I'm not sure just the 3/4 thickness of the top would be strong enough. Maybe I'm wrong about that though. Or do you think I should still go with a hardwood support block on the top? If so what would you recommend?

If I do an additional support block I don't think I'd thread all the way through to the surface of the top. Maybe stop 1/2" or so from the top, that would give me about an inch of thread. Think that would be enough?

Brian.

 

[FredP]

Fred, I think 1/2 would probably be too small too. However, it looks like the threading kits aren't as expensive as I thought they would be. Think one like this in 1" would give me enough surface area? I would still go with a reinforcement block on the bottom to give me more thread depth cause I'm not sure just the 3/4 thickness of the top would be strong enough. Maybe I'm wrong about that though. Or do you think I should still go with a hardwood support block on the top? If so what would you recommend?

If I do an additional support block I don't think I'd thread all the way through to the surface of the top. Maybe stop 1/2" or so from the top, that would give me about an inch of thread. Think that would be enough?

Brian.

yep yep and yep... BUT [there is always a but isn't there] I would try to find one in 1"x8tpi. it would be a dual purpose tool then when you get your new lathe.:rotflm: I would get as close as I could to the surface though because the reads will be tapered near the end. 1/8"-1/4" would be my goal.