Using Wet Framing Lumber

[Tarhead]

I've got a small (4X16) expansion planned to the back of my shed for wood storage. It will be a lean-to against the back of the shed, closed in with T-111 siding.

I will be getting wet, freshly sawn 2X framing lumber from Randy (Woodbutcher). Should I immediately get this lumber framed or would I be OK stacking(not stickering), ratchet strapping and covering it for ~1 week? This will be next week so the weather will be cool. I don't want to end up with a stack of 2X pretzels. I can get those at Home Depot:help:
Thanks!
Mark

 

[DaveO]

Either work with it right away or stack and sticker with ratchet straps and other devices to hold it flat. I would be afraid that is you didn't allow for air flow around all sides of the boards you would end up with some crap in the middle. Although a week isn't too long of a time, and the temps are cool with moist air. You probably wouldn't end up worse than BORG lumber. I have never seen a straight board there.
Dave

 

[jeff...]

I've got a small (4X16) expansion planned to the back of my shed for wood storage. It will be a lean-to against the back of the shed, closed in with T-111 siding.

I will be getting wet, freshly sawn 2X framing lumber from Randy (Woodbutcher). Should I immediately get this lumber framed or would I be OK stacking(not stickering), ratchet strapping and covering it for ~1 week? This will be next week so the weather will be cool. I don't want to end up with a stack of 2X pretzels. I can get those at Home Depot:help:
Thanks!
Mark

Mark keep in mind that this is my advise only. There are two trains of thought.

#1 - Wet lumber is going to shrink - there are several calculators out there to help you determine how much. Take this into account when you frame up whatever your going to build. Cut em a little long so when they draw up you'll be pretty close to square when the lumber dries.

#2 Stack and sticker the lumber as you mentioned applying ample pressure to keep your boards straight. Unlike hardwood, pine can dry real fast, without much risk of degrade (Scott please chime in here). I think you only need to get to around 15% MC for outdoor use - If I recall correctly most framing lumber is KD/AD 15, even framing lumber used to stick build a house.

No matter which way you go, treat for inserts - PPB / termites / carpenter bees love SYP. This is one advantage to KD over AD you get a sure kill. But for exposed SYP I would still treat or bugs, irregardless if my framing lumber was kiln or air dried - after all, this is the south, ya know.

Have fun...

 

[jmauldin]

I built a 6 x 30 lean-to on the back of my shop out of lumber straight from the sawmill. It was only stacked for about 3 days before I used it. Had no problems. (Also built my shop (20x30) the same way). I would take the advice to have it treated.
Looking ahead, however, when you enclose it (mine is open on one end) leave plenty of space for ventilation. I had a lot of problems with mildew on the lumber I stacked there until I went back and opened up the bottom about 6 inches off the ground all the way around. There is also room for air movement at the ceiling. It isn't a good feeling when you buy some expensive plywood only to have it covered in mold.
Jim in Mayberry

 

[jeff...]

Jim has some good tips and it would help if I read the opening post more carefully. If your going to enclose it while green with T111 ply - I would let it air dry some before you nail up that expensive ply wood. Good tip on circulation and mold Jim. I've always used V and W notched wall bracing and 1x8 siding (like they did back in the old days). I think the siding style is called lap, it's just a 1x8 with no special angle cuts. So I never really had a problem with circulation since my siding was not nailed flat to the outside walls. Anyways the siding looks like this - you can see there is plenty of room for air circulation in between the siding and wall studs.

Later...

 

[Tarhead]

Thanks Guys!
The framing lumber will be closed in with T-111 type siding and will be ventilated well with end vents. Probably will not put a full plywood floor in to keep good airflow and use window screen for the openings to keep the bugs out. The majority of the inside will be storage racks for hardwood lumber. The floor/rim joists and sole plate will be up on blocks and Pressure Treated. The wet lumber will be used for the stud walls, roof joists and doors. I was thinking the wet lumber would stay more stable if it was not alowed to start to dry. That's why I didn't want to sticker it for the short time it will be sitting.
As far as treating it...what do you suggest?

 

[jeff...]

Thanks Guys!
The framing lumber will be closed in with T-111 type siding and will be ventilated well with end vents. Probably will not put a full plywood floor in to keep good airflow and use window screen for the openings to keep the bugs out. The majority of the inside will be storage racks for hardwood lumber. The floor/rim joists and sole plate will be up on blocks and Pressure Treated. The wet lumber will be used for the stud walls, roof joists and doors. I was thinking the wet lumber would stay more stable if it was not alowed to start to dry. That's why I didn't want to sticker it for the short time it will be sitting.
As far as treating it...what do you suggest?

Boric Acid seems to be poplar ---> http://www.alsnetbiz.com/homeimprovement/boric_acid.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boric_acid

There a lot of other products too, need some folks to chime in here...

 

[scsmith42]

Mark, you really should sticker the green pine boards. Use dry stickers (3/4" to 1" thick) on 16" centers for the best results. Make your stacks about 3' wide (give or take). One week of air drying will help remove some of the surface moisture on the boards, and it will not hurt the strength or stability. Be sure to inspect the pine for any signs of borers, beetles, etc, and don't use any boards that exhibit signs of these pests. When you cover your stacks, be sure to leave an air space between the covering and the stack of lumber.

Although this is the right time of year for building with green lumber, you may encounter a problem if you try to side it soon with the T111 within the next 90 - 120 days or so.. Have you considered board and batten?

Re treatment, I use Timbor. You can buy a 5 gallon pail off of E-bay for around 80 bucks. Treat the lumber at least twice.

Scott

 

[LeftyTom]

You probably wouldn't end up worse than BORG lumber. I have never seen a straight board there.
Dave

That is not true, Dave. I took a straight 8' 2x4 in the one in Winston once, and asked the ever helpful staff, "Do you have a few of these?" :rolf:

 

[jeff...]

Mark, you really should sticker the green pine boards. Use dry stickers (3/4" to 1" thick) on 16" centers for the best results. Make your stacks about 3' wide (give or take). One week of air drying will help remove some of the surface moisture on the boards, and it will not hurt the strength or stability. Be sure to inspect the pine for any signs of borers, beetles, etc, and don't use any boards that exhibit signs of these pests. When you cover your stacks, be sure to leave an air space between the covering and the stack of lumber.

Although this is the right time of year for building with green lumber, you may encounter a problem if you try to side it soon with the T111 within the next 90 - 120 days or so.. Have you considered board and batten?

Re treatment, I use Timbor. You can buy a 5 gallon pail off of E-bay for around 80 bucks. Treat the lumber at least twice.

Scott

Scott, do you know if the active ingredient of TimBor is Boric Acid?

Scott is spot on here - but I'm wondering can the lumber be treated when you stack and sticker it? Seems it would be a lot easier to do it then , instead of when it already framed.

Thanks

 

[Tarhead]

Yep, Timbor is pure Boric Acid. I already have some I used to treat my shed and some areas in the Garage where I saw some termite activity around the foundation. I'll just spray it on when I stack and sticker. It's also a fungicide.
Thanks!

 

[jeff...]

Yep, Timbor is pure Boric Acid. I already have some I used to treat my shed and some areas in the Garage where I saw some termite activity around the foundation. I'll just spray it on when I stack and sticker. It's also a fungicide.
Thanks!

Thanks Mark - I had a sneaking suspicion it was
http://www.domyownpestcontrol.com/timbor-p-144.html

One other thing I forgot to mention - Unless you ordered 6/4, I'm sure those boards your getting from Randy will be real dimensional lumber - unlike BORG dimensional lumber where a 2x4 is really 1 1/2 x 3 1/2. Beat them together with 20d nails, 16d won't cut the mustard when working with the real stuff. ccasion1

Later

 

[Steve W]

It appears that a product called Borrada is the same thing, but a little bit less money, for those of you who don't want to buy off eBay:

http://store.doyourownpestcontrol.c...469057b93ba27404200c15f06b8/Product/View/I069

They're both disodium octaborate tetrahydrate ( Na(2)B(8)O(13)*4H(2)O ) My rapidly-receding Chem 101 memory sees this as a salt. It's the Boron that kills the bugglies...

:kermit: Steve

 

[scsmith42]

Scott, do you know if the active ingredient of TimBor is Boric Acid?

Scott is spot on here - but I'm wondering can the lumber be treated when you stack and sticker it? Seems it would be a lot easier to do it then , instead of when it already framed.

Thanks

Jeff - yup - I knew that - hence my recommendation.

If you AD the lumber for a few weeks, and then treat it twice before using it, you will get better penetration than if it's treated while it's still green. I concur that it's best to treat it before using it.

 

[Tarhead]

Well a few weeks have passed since since I got my loads of SYP from Randy (WoodButcher). I took the stack/treat/dry for a while advice and so far so good. No mildew, splits, curls, bugs etc. I gets covered if the weather report says rain but otherwise it's in the open and shaded other than early in the morning. Moisture meter says 15% and will begin construction in a few weeks. I'm hesitant to use some of the SYP for construction as it's very nice, straight grained lumber with very few knots. Most of the 2X6s are knot free:thumbsup:. If you're in the CLT area planning to build something and don't need stamped lumber give Randy a shot at supplying it.
Here's the Stack-O-Wood with some of Jeff's Walnut and 4, 4X6 RO beams sandwiched in there:

 

[Gotcha6]

IIRC from my log home rep days, Timbor is Sodium Borate. The good thing about it is it does not discolor the wood as much as other treatment properties, but it is not for use below grade or in damp locations. It does have a very low toxicity. The LD50 (Lethal dose for 50% of the population) is the same as table salt. Treatment should be done when the lumber is still green.