Tool Tinker (cont) Lathe *w/pics*

Status
Not open for further replies.

Alan in Little Washington

Alan Schaffter
Corporate Member
This may be a feeble attempt at making a silk purse out of a sows ear, but I am a tinkerer and can't leave anything alone. This time it is my lathe.

I bought a small, used Delta 46-701 12" lathe off Ebay a few years back. Since I'm not much of a turner it meets my needs. One thing I didn't like was the Reeves drive type speed control. Awkward and noisy. So my initial tinkering was to remove the Reeves drive, change out the pulleys, add a Power Twist link belt, put on a bigger motor (replaced a 3/4 hp 1725 rpm, Emerson with a 1.5 hp, 3450 rpm, Baldor (Ebay :-D), add a better switch (Delta) (the original switch was just a toggle switch mounted to the motor connection box), and add a variable frequency drive (Ebay again) to control the speed. Since my last shop was tiny, I made a set of bench feet for the lathe. I mounted the VFD and new switch to a plate attached to the headstock.

Lathe-2.JPG


Lathe-3.JPG


In addition to the items mentioned above, this closeup of the headstock shows my latest addition- the small black box below the VFD that contains the tach circuit and digital readout:

Lathe-4.JPG



In addition to the problems with the Reeves drive mentioned above, I never liked the gross rpm scale that you matched with the lever position, and of course I had none with the VFD, though I could have made a frequency to rpm table. I finally found a reasonably priced, nice little tach from MKC Tools (they sell tach kits and parts to restore Shopsmiths). At my request they sent it to me without the readout mounted so I could make my own lower profile custom installation or even remote mount the display. In the pic below a second display is mounted on a piece of circuit board material from Radio Shack and will be part of the future VFD and tach installation on my drill press. The tach unit comes with a small (2" X 3" X 3/4") circuit board and an illuminator/pick-up which is aimed at a target (sample provided) which you attach to a pulley, shaft, etc. I couldn't find a project box the right size so I made one out of thin ply and painted it black. The tach runs on 9-12 VDC. I have it hard wired through a small toggle switch to a 9V battery. It is very accurate. There are two versions of the tach- one just displays rpm, the other you can select rpm or sfpm. Other users are adding these units to metal lathes, mills, etc. etc.

Lathe-1.JPG


Here is the unit powered up at a low VFD setting (10 Hz = 337 rpm- it will go down to zero)

Lathe-7.JPG


Mid range (60 Hz = 2040 rpm):

Lathe-5.JPG


An upper speed (88 Hz = 3000 rpm)

Lathe-6.JPG


The lower and upper VFD limits can be programmed wherever I want. And before all you electro-mechanical whizzes out there jump all over me, I know there are disadvantages to this setup- torque and motor heating problems at low rpms, bearing wear at high motor rpms. Anyway, time will tell if any of these issues cause me problems.

The last upgrade for the lathe will to make a new, substantial, floor stand.
 

woodguy1975

New User
John
I'll leave you alone on the motor, but for anyone wanting to do what Alan did you should use a constant torque inverter rated motor. I'll also leave the torque and heat issue alone. :rolf: That delta drive is very similar to the one Jet puts on the 1642. Pretty good inverter. Mitsubishi makes a pretty nice little single phase inverter as well.

Nice job Alan.
 

sapwood

New User
Roger
Well Alan, I'm pretty much speechless 8-O I would have been proud just to have got the rust off and the lathe running :lol::lol:

Thanks for the continued sharing of your creativity and engineering skills :icon_thum

Roger
 

Alan in Little Washington

Alan Schaffter
Corporate Member
I am looking at a used lathe and was wondering about this very thing.

How would this compare to a DC motor and controller?

Is the DC better at low RPM as far as torque and overheating?

Does a 1 HP DC have enough torque at low RPM to turn 14 inch bowls?

Any other advantages/concerns?

The answers are complex. There is a big tradeoff in size, weight, performance and cost for the various setups. The link is a pseudo-scientific report on the development of the Nova DVR. It discusses the operations, disadvantages, relative costs, etc. of variable speed DC and AC drive systems.

http://www.ipenz.org.nz/ipenz/forms/pdfs/TreNz5.pdf
 
J

jeff...

I think Alan might just be reason I can't win anything off ebay :-(. You going to turn a pen on that lathe? With all the upgrades, "hulk" might just spit out pens all by it'self. 8-O
 

Alan in Little Washington

Alan Schaffter
Corporate Member
I think Alan might just be reason I can't win anything off ebay :-(. You going to turn a pen on that lathe? With all the upgrades, "hulk" might just spit out pens all by it'self. 8-O

I got most of the Ebay stuff a few years ago. Now most of the really good Ebay deals are gone. Crazy people are bidding things up to retail and more! I still watch, and more often than not, never even bid. I waited over two years once for one item to come up for bid at a reasonable price. There are two Gast vacuum pumps currently on Ebay that are located in the Raleigh area. One was receiving active bidding which was driving the price up, but the other got no bids . . . . until yesterday. I don't "need" one that bad.
 

Alan in Little Washington

Alan Schaffter
Corporate Member
I read the report and still am confused. They seem to say DC is better but went with AC?

What is the disadvantage to DC?


And still I ask is 1 HP enough?

I think what the article is saying is that DC provides better torque at low RPM but to get the full RPM/torque range you need a large, EXPENSIVE DC motor and controller. Teknatool's solution was to make their own special, computer controlled, brushless, DC motor that they call DVR (digital variable reluctance) for the NOVA DVR lathe. I doubled the horsepower of my lathe from 3/4 hp to 1.5 hp. What I am hoping, is that I won't be roughing blanks at low RPM too long and too hard for the motor to overheat. The toque and copper/iron heating issue happens with the AC induction motors at low RPM- the low frequency put out by the VFD at these RPM's is hard on them.

I would have used an even larger motor*, but there seems to be a big jump in the cost of VFD's once you get over about 1.5 hp. Oh, did I mention that VFD's put out 3 phase so your motor needs to be 3 phase. Maybe Woodguy1975 will jump in here before I embarrass myself even more from my true lack of knowledge about this stuff.\

* I have a spare, brand new (old stock) 3 Hp, 3 phase, Baldor that I pulled out of my shaper when I installed a single phase motor.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Premier Sponsor

Our Sponsors

LATEST FOR SALE LISTINGS

Top