Ring Shake in Cherry

[Barbara Gill]

I have been running a sawmill up here in VA since 1985. During that time there have been two almost universal "truths" I have observed. One is that most Spruce Pine has red heart. The other is that most of the large Cherry trees have ring shake. This is not the shake commonly found in the center of the logs nor it it the occasional growth ring that has been affected by drought, injury, etc. This is almost total, white with fungal growth shaken Cherry that is unusable under normal circumstances. In fact the large Cherry logs (20"-30"+ sed) that I have sawn that do not have shake are few.

I have speculated that possibly this shake has something to do with the growing conditions in Eastern VA. The growing conditions in Eastern NC are almost the same. I don't hold much with the "wind shake" label as all trees in an area are subject to the same wind stress.

Sooooo what has been the experience of other sawyers?

 

[Kyle]

I think ring shake is a function of the wind patterns in your area. Areas with high winds frequently have trees that exhibit ring shake stress.


I know that some of the cherry in the mountain logs I get from time to time have LOTS of shake.

the lowland cherry tends to only have mineral streaks and knots.

kyle

 

[cpowell]

Do you have any pics of this in sawn stock? I Googled it and found a few things but curious what it looks like. I have bought AD cherry a few times and it had a lot of stress cracks and cracks near the center, which I took to be pithy areas.

Chuck

 

[Barbara Gill]

Do you have any pics of this in sawn stock? I Googled it and found a few things but curious what it looks like. I have bought AD cherry a few times and it had a lot of stress cracks and cracks near the center, which I took to be pithy areas.

Chuck

No I don't. Stress cracks are not ring shake. If you can visualize a flat sawn board. Each ring section is like a shallow dish. When there is ring shake, these pieces of wood will sometimes come completely free from the board.

 

[Barbara Gill]

Dr. Gene Wengert who used to teach at Virginia Tech and is the resident expert on the Sawing and Drying forum of Woodweb is one of the scientists who subscribe to the theory that the generalized ring shake I am talking about is attributable to bacteria which enters the tree through its roots and weakens the structure.

If a tree is so infected then wind can play a part as the ring structure has been weakened. If wind was the primary culprit the all trees in the same location would have a shake problem.

There is some interesting information available on the Woodweb.
Cutting "shake" out of logs
What Causes Ring Shake?

 

[Kyle]

The bacteria theory is plausible and in my opinion may contribute to separation, but anecdotal experience from logs I buy show that wind definitely has a function in creating the environment for bacteria to thrive. Just like an animal or person an injury creates opportunity..the bacteria enter through an injury on the outside ( knot hole, scrap, insect)and manifest through an internal injury(ring shake).

also several of the multi-generational loggers I deal with call it "wind shake".

 

[Barbara Gill]

Actually if you read the total article you will see that the type of entry Dr. Wengert is talking about for this particular bacteria is not through injury but through the roots.

We have to be careful of taking what generations of any one group have been calling something. I do not mean that as a put down at all. What became an explanation for something years and years ago and is now accepted as fact is not always the real reason. Medicine is a fertile ground for this opinion. If we still accepted the original reasons for Bubonic Plague we never would have discovered the real cause.

 

[jeff...]

My 2 cents only, so take it for what it's worth...

Cherry is a pretty soft wood when it comes to hardwood and it closed grain. So it stands to reason it's susceptible to shake in windy areas. The best saw logs are from the interior of a mature forest. It's there that under story trees like cherry are protected from wind by the canopy of more taller and stronger trees like oaks and hickory. It's in these low light conditions cherry will grow slow thus forming tightly spaced growth rings which is preferred by woodworkers anyways the tighter the growth rings the stronger the tree will be. Cherry grown along the forest edges or in someones yard, generally yield very low grade lumber and is almost always slap full of wind shake.

Always endseal logs with a product like ancorseal as soon as you buck them to length - this greatly reduces the amount of moisture a log will loose through it's endgrain. Like sycamore, Cherry should be sawn into lumber ASAP. Ideally, log day one, mill day 2, kiln dry day3 - this is the best method I know for successful lumber making. End sealing is perhaps the most important thing you can do to help preserve the log for a longer period of time. however endsealing does little good unless is't applied immediately after the tree is felled and bucked, putting sealer on old bucked logs is a waste of time. Limited amount of success can be achieved buy cutting the log ends back past where it's checked and then applying sealer. This shortens the log which produces less BF yeild at the mill.

If you have access to a pond, you can store logs in a pond and they will stay fresher longer, until you find time to saw them. What you don't want to do is to store logs out in the open where sun winds and rain will degrade (dry them out) quickly. At least pile them up in a shady location, if you cant saw them for a couple of weeks.

Old dried out cherry logs, rarely produce good lumber, but make great firewood. Bottom line don't mess with old dried out cherry logs your chance to make good lumber is already past, you success will be very low.

North Carolina Cherry is pretty much hit or miss anyways - the area has been loged twice since the turn of the century and planted over mostly in pine. The best Cherry comes from up north where there is a shorter growing season and temps drop long enough in the winter to kill bugs.

I've passed on hundreds of cherry logs around here - I'm very picky about the logs I buy to be made into lumber to re-sale - a good log makes good lumber - you can't expect to make good lumber out of low grade logs - your just ****ing ino the wind.

One other thing... Why do you think cherry is so expensive? It's not because it's rare - there are plenty of trees to harvest. It's because yield is low at the mill.