Waterlox Vs. General Finishes

[NOTW]

I am looking to finish a Walnut table top and was all ready to go with Waterlox Original Sealer/Finish, but then when searching through Klingspor's website I came across the General Finishes High performance water based polyurethane and even the Enduro-Var (although I am leaning against the Enduro-Var do to the website saying it has a slight amber tint to it).

So my question is Waterlox Vs. General Finishes for a couple of points, ease of application and quality of the product over time. I am not looking for a high gloss finish, something more in a semi-gloss range. I have always used minwax polyurethane and was looking for something a little higher quality for this table, any suggestion or recommendations are welcome.

Thank you,
Jason

 

[golfdad]

I have some General Finish water based poly if you want to try some

 

[KenOfCary]

I like Oil based finishes probably because that is mostly all I ever use. My all-time favorite is Tried & True brand Varnish Oil. It will give a slight amber tint to wood but you won't notice that on Walnut. It really brings out the colors of Walnut.

It is a wipe-on varnish. Wipe or brush it on with a foam brush and after an hour wipe off the excess with a cloth or paper rag. Fool-proof and can be touched up if you find a blemish or glue squeeze-out you missed. Simply scrape or sand the blemish and re-apply - it blends right in.

 

[jazzflute]

I've used all three on Walnut. They are VERY different from one another. The two GF products are very nice, but it is obvious that they create a surface film on the walnut. If your wood has a lot of color variation (not steamed walnut), then my experience is that the GF finishes will dull it a little bit; it is obvious that the finish sits on top of the wood.

Waterlox works that way too, but it doesn't look like it. It really makes the walnut 'pop' and highlights the depth and color variation of the wood. It is MUCH more work to apply Waterlox (more coats, and brushed vs. the way I do GF, which is to spray it), but the result is spectacular. It is my 'go to' finish for nice walnut.

K

 

[Hmerkle]

I've used all three on Walnut. They are VERY different from one another. The two GF products are very nice, but it is obvious that they create a surface film on the walnut. If your wood has a lot of color variation (not steamed walnut), then my experience is that the GF finishes will dull it a little bit; it is obvious that the finish sits on top of the wood.

Waterlox works that way too, but it doesn't look like it. It really makes the walnut 'pop' and highlights the depth and color variation of the wood. It is MUCH more work to apply Waterlox (more coats, and brushed vs. the way I do GF, which is to spray it), but the result is spectacular. It is my 'go to' finish for nice walnut.

K

Kevin,
can you not spray Waterlox?
Or is it just a better finish to brush it on?

 

[Gofor]

Behlans Rock Hard TableTop Finish is excellent on air dried walnut. It would be brush on, but it levels very well. A little amber to it as with most oil based varnishes (it is a phenolic varnish, not a polyurethane). I bought mine at Klingspors in Raleigh, but do not know if they still carry it.

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Still holding up great after more than 5 years.

Go

 

[Jeff]

A question and a few thoughts.

1. Is this table top a dining table, coffee table, end table?

2. An amber cast on a dark wood = zero visual effect.

3. No problem spraying Waterlox Original Sealer/Finish right out of the can.

 

[JohnW]

+1 for Behlans Rock Hard Table Top Finish. I've used it on several well used dinning tables and coffee tables, and it really holds up under typical table top wear. You can brush it on out of the can but also thin it with spirits about 10%-15% and wipe it on. Brushing builds faster but wipe on is easier to apply and looks better to my eye. If your table will be used for eating this is a very good finish. If table is more for display, I really like the Tried & True mentioned above.

Also, IMHO, a slight amber tint on walnut is a good thing.

 

[NOTW]

A question and a few thoughts.

1. Is this table top a dining table, coffee table, end table?

2. An amber cast on a dark wood = zero visual effect.

3. No problem spraying Waterlox Original Sealer/Finish right out of the can.

1. Table is a dining room table, that being said my dining room table doesn't get as much use as most, its more of an occasional and holiday table.

2. Good to know

3. The only thing i have to spray with is a cheap Harbor Freight HVLP gun so it will most likely be brushed or wiped on.

 

[NOTW]

+1 for Behlans Rock Hard Table Top Finish. I've used it on several well used dinning tables and coffee tables, and it really holds up under typical table top wear. You can brush it on out of the can but also thin it with spirits about 10%-15% and wipe it on. Brushing builds faster but wipe on is easier to apply and looks better to my eye. If your table will be used for eating this is a very good finish. If table is more for display, I really like the Tried & True mentioned above.

Also, IMHO, a slight amber tint on walnut is a good thing.

The only issue I see with the Behlans is that it only comes in satin or gloss, the wife has requested more of a semi gloss finish...

 

[jazzflute]

Kevin,
can you not spray Waterlox?
Or is it just a better finish to brush it on?

Technically yes. But it sprays at roughly a 5:1 ratio with brushing, and it is a finish that needs to build. When brushed, it takes 4 or 5 coats to build. Doing the math, and given it's long dry time between coats, spraying turns into almost a month long process. You've been to my shop, so you know if I could find a way to spray it effectively, I would!

;-)

K

 

[Hmerkle]

Technically yes. But it sprays at roughly a 5:1 ratio with brushing, and it is a finish that needs to build. When brushed, it takes 4 or 5 coats to build. Doing the math, and given it's long dry time between coats, spraying turns into almost a month long process. You've been to my shop, so you know if I could find a way to spray it effectively, I would!

;-)

K

I knew you would know (and have a good explanation for why or why not!)

 

[Jeff]

The only issue I see with the Behlans is that it only comes in satin or gloss, the wife has requested more of a semi gloss finish...

If you like the Behlen's try the gloss. Knock it back to a semi-gloss with 0000 steel wool or a synthetic sanding pad with the grain. Maybe use mineral spirits as a sanding lubricant instead of dry sanding.

 

[Chilihead]

I agree with Jazzflute. Waterlox looks spectacular on walnut. This is my go to finish for most projects. It is oil based and it does give wood an amber tone. This can sometimes be undesirable on some lighter woods depending on the look you're going for. Yet on darker woods like walnut I believe it only enhances the color. Many of the water based finishes dry clear. I don't know about these General Finishes specifically. But pieces I've done in walnut and finished with a clear finish have a much colder look than the ones finished in Waterlox. The amber tone really warms the color and the oil in it helps highlight the grain for more depth.

 

[minnehahas]

I agree with Chillihead and Jazzflute. Waterlox is the way to go. So easy to apply and get right. Watch the www.askwoodman.com videos if you have any questions he has a pretty good set on Waterlox. I used the stuff on all my cabinets and much of my outdoor woodwork on our house we had on Utila Honduras (right on the ocean) and I can attest to how well it holds up. We used to order pallets of the stuff and have it shipped to our Island for all the homes.

Gary

 

[NOTW]

Seems like Waterlox is the way to go, that you everybody for the responses! Now to find a dry day so I can apply in my shop/garage with the door open and without the worry of the wind blowing rain in...

 

[SubGuy]

I use waterlox on most everything. I wipe it on with a lint free rag, let it sit to dry and do it again. I normally don't sand until I'm into 3 or 4 coats, even then 320 is the most coarse I would go. It's not as durable as Rock Hard (I've used that as well), but it's way easier to get right. Make sure you get some bloxogen either way to keep those finishes from hardening in the can. Waterlox will gel up on you if you don't keep the oxygen out. Mine normally goes bad before I finish a can.

 

[Howard Acheson]

>>>> (although I am leaning against the Enduro-Var do to the website saying it has a slight amber tint to it)

Let me caution you that if you do not want a yellow tinted finish, do not use Waterlox. Waterlox is a very yellow tinted finish. That said, a yellow tint is generally used for Walnut. The yellow brings out the color and grain of the wood. Waterborne finishes tend to be clear and colorless. When used on Walnut, they leave a sort of "washed out" appearance.

If you want no color to your finish, stick with a waterborne finish. Whatever finish you end up using be sure to test it on some of your scrap to see how it looks.

BTW, what do you mean by: "I have always used minwax polyurethane and was looking for something a little higher quality for this table"

 

[NOTW]

>>>>
BTW, what do you mean by: "I have always used minwax polyurethane and was looking for something a little higher quality for this table"

On other projects I have done in the past my go to finish was always a minwax polyurethane which has worked fine, I just wanted to make sure what I used on this table was going to last

 

[SubGuy]

I wouldn't call Waterlox yellow, maybe brownish. It will come out golden brown on light woods, but it darkens with building coats. On Walnut, it really doesn't change the color much of the heartwood, but can tint the sapwood if it is steam dried.

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That is Waterlox on cherry.

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Waterlox on HM. The picture is deceiving. It is less yellow than shown (cheap camera).

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Waterlox on European Beech and Walnut.

I hope this helps see the color better. By far it's not clear, but looks really natural and brings out grain.