Need Help From Qualified Electrician

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woodnick

New User
Nick
I'm going to change the ballast in some of my fluorescent fixtures from T12 to T8's. When I started to read the instructions the first thing it say's " Do not install this ballast in a residential environment" WHY:eusa_doh::eusa_doh:I need this infor. as soon as possible because I already took the light fixture down (dumb I know:BangHead: )
 

DaveO

New User
DaveO
Nick, I moved your thread from the Site Help forum to the Home Improvement/DIY forum so it might get more exposure from folks that might have an answer to your question.
My guess it that is just a legal-ese statement to cover any liability, but I don't really know. I can't see why you couldn't use a different ballast in a "residential environment", especially your own.
Dave:)
 

RayH

New User
Ray
Nick,
A guess from a non-electrician -- Is there an FCC "Class" rating on the ballast? Residential and commercial environments have different electronic "noise" requirements.

Could be this.:icon_scra

Ray
 

Steve W

New User
Steve
Ray's on the right track, methinks.

Fluorescent fixtures generate a lot of RF hash.:qleft7:

I can hear some of them on 160m. :kamahlitu

:kermit: Steve
 

Don Sorensen

New User
Butch
I bet Ray is on the right track as well. The T -xx number refers to the diameter of the lamp, in eighths of an inch....so a T-8 lamp is 1 inch in Diameter, and a T-12 is 1-1/2 inches in diameter.

http://members.misty.com/don/f-lamp.html#fltoc has all kinds of interesting stuff about flourescent lamps...but nothing I could find about residential vs. non-residential use - other than "typical uses".

hmmm, no smiley getting zapped. Best of luck!
 

JackLeg

New User
Reggie
Nick: I have "commercial fixtures" in my basement, garage, and shop. I have the "high output, low temp" varieties. You should be fine. Sounds like a standard disclaimer to me.
:biggrin:
 

cpowell

Chuck
Senior User
I bet Ray is on the right track as well. The T -xx number refers to the diameter of the lamp, in eighths of an inch....so a T-8 lamp is 1 inch in Diameter, and a T-12 is 1-1/2 inches in diameter.

http://members.misty.com/don/f-lamp.html#fltoc has all kinds of interesting stuff about flourescent lamps...but nothing I could find about residential vs. non-residential use - other than "typical uses".

hmmm, no smiley getting zapped. Best of luck!
Good reading at the link. I didn't read everything (A.D.D. kicked in) but thought this excerpt from the section on electronic ballasts was interesting...


I have heard, however, of problems with these relating to radio frequency interference from the ballasts and tubes. Other complaints have resulted due to erratic behavior of electronic equipment using infra red remote controls. There is a small amount of IR emission from the fluorescent tubes themselves and this ends up being pulsed at the inverter frequencies which are sometimes similar to those used by IR hand held remote controls.

I'd like to know what you think of the replacement ballasts/lamps. My cheap BORG shop lights have darkened over time and I need to both upgrade and ADD more fixtures.


Chuck
 

RayH

New User
Ray
I'd like to know what you think of the replacement ballasts/lamps. My cheap BORG shop lights have darkened over time and I need to both upgrade and ADD more fixtures.


Chuck[/quote]
Remembering that I am not an electrician: :dontknow:I believe that if you buy reasonable quality electronic ballast units and T-8 bulbs and install them with good grounding you will have much better service life, less interference in both RF and IR devices, and spend less money than if you buy cheap T-12 devices with magnetic ballast. I expect you will find them equally bright, better starting in cold weather, and replace fewer bulbs and ballast.

But then, that's just my opinion.:icon_scra

Best of luck with your lights,
RayH
 

woodnick

New User
Nick
The reason I needed this information quickly was because I had removed the old ballast before reading the directions for the new ballast. But I just stopped work on them until monday and called GE for the answer. The reason for the commercial vs residential difference is GE assumes that all commercial buildings are grounded but not all residential buildings are grounded. "Donna" from GE told me if my building is well grounded everything will be OK.
The reason for changing these ballast is the fixtures were very old commercial drop in's that the ballast went bad and I did'nt want to replace the fixtures.
T8 is the size of the bulb but also is the way to tell new electronic from old magnetic ballast. T8 use less electicity and the the half life of T8 is much better then T12's
Changing now put's me ahead of the curve. Because I think T8 is what BIG BROTHER want's us to use.
 

Don Sorensen

New User
Butch
I'm not really one to consult regarding flourescent lights - I have two levels of experience on the residential front.
1. SLowe's had a clearance sale on your standard 48" electronic ballast fixtures - clearance priced, on the order of $7 apiece - of the 12 fixtures that my buddy bought, none survived the year - in every case the cheap P.O.S. "electronics" gave up the magic smoke that makes them work.

2. I went ahead and bought the "typical" 48" fixtures for something like $15 ea. But at one time, I bought Philips bulbs, and the others I bought GE bulbs. The Philips flicker and buzz and take for ever to settle down after a cold night. NO more cheap Philips bulbs in my shop.

3. My tiny brain hasn't figured out what "BORG" means. 8-p

Good luck and check that power before re-wiring.
Don
 

Bas

Recovering tool addict
Bas
Corporate Member
BORG = Big Orange Retail Giant = Home Depot. If you watch "Star Trek", the Borg is an alien race that turns individuals into drones (space zombies) and assimilates them into a collective mind. Sort of what the big box retailers do when they open up and push out the smaller stores.

Lowe's is also considered to be part of the collective, BORG can mean either one.

There is some debate on the plural of BORG, if that even exists. BORGS, BORGEN and BORK BORK BORK are all acceptable variations.
 

Gofor

Mark
Corporate Member
The term BORG is transmorgrifying into an entity which is doing its own assimilation much like Mr Bas's StarTrek associates:
It first referred to HD (Big Orange Retail Giant) and then assimilated Lowes, and then Costco and is now in the process of assimilating WalMart, Sears, KMart and all other chain retailers of home repair products. They do this appealing to those of the gentler persuasion by using programmed drones which are named "Sales Associates" that target these unsuspecting targets with a cheerful "How can I help you?" The target responds with a question about a project that being contemplated. The "Sales Associate" then displays this wealth of cheap quality merchandise that falls somewhere in the category of the project while using catch phrases of "Quick" and "Easy", while sending subliminal messages to the target with phrases like "anyone can do it" or "idiot proof", knowing full well the target thinks their spouse, who will be doing said project fits one of these categories, or else the spouse would be here instead of the target. After the target leaves the BORG with a car load of just enough inferior substance to get the project going, the spouse then returns to confront the "Sales Associate" about all the stuff still needed and why the target wasn't informed of it. The "Sales Associate" then goes into "deflective engagement" mode, redirecting the spouse to the tool dept, using terms like "A-R-R-G-H" and "More Power". The spouse then leaves with another car load of cheap merchandise and another couple has been assimilated.
This can all be validated by a knowledgeable person knowing what the project really entails going into the BORG and asking a technical question about the project. The "Sales Associate's" program will promptly overload and will result in either "I don't work this dept" or "I will get you someone who knows about this" upon which they will depart to never be seen again.
This insidious invasion of our communities is also causing the demise of the local businesses where actual people with actual knowledge about home repair and DIY projects were employed. This is because the targets have more time than spouses to interact with the merchandising community. When targets entered the local business, and were confronted with pertinent technical questions about the project in a language that they could not comprehend, they felt threatened, and so sought the comfort of the place where "any idiot, even your spouse can do it" and technical questions would not be asked by a stupid drone. If they did pick up on a technical term that the spouse had uttered, they could use it and get "that's a good point" and shown even more cheap merchandise to buy.
The only protection against the BORG is for those that dwell with "targets": Never let them enter a BORG, destroy any "Sales Papers" before they enter the living premises, and block all "Home Improvement" channels from the TV reception.
I know that sounds impossible, and once in a while you'll really have to fix something!! (but that leads to a new tool, so guess you have to visit the BORG)

"Resistance is Futile":rotflm::rotflm:

Go
 

DaveO

New User
DaveO
The term BORG is transmorgrifying into an entity which is doing its own assimilation much like Mr Bas's StarTrek associates:
It first referred to HD (Big Orange Retail Giant) and then assimilated Lowes, and then Costco and is now in the process of assimilating WalMart, Sears, KMart and all other chain retailers of home repair products. They do this appealing to those of the gentler persuasion by using programmed drones which are named "Sales Associates" that target these unsuspecting targets with a cheerful "How can I help you?" The target responds with a question about a project that being contemplated. The "Sales Associate" then displays this wealth of cheap quality merchandise that falls somewhere in the category of the project while using catch phrases of "Quick" and "Easy", while sending subliminal messages to the target with phrases like "anyone can do it" or "idiot proof", knowing full well the target thinks their spouse, who will be doing said project fits one of these categories, or else the spouse would be here instead of the target. After the target leaves the BORG with a car load of just enough inferior substance to get the project going, the spouse then returns to confront the "Sales Associate" about all the stuff still needed and why the target wasn't informed of it. The "Sales Associate" then goes into "deflective engagement" mode, redirecting the spouse to the tool dept, using terms like "A-R-R-G-H" and "More Power". The spouse then leaves with another car load of cheap merchandise and another couple has been assimilated.
This can all be validated by a knowledgeable person knowing what the project really entails going into the BORG and asking a technical question about the project. The "Sales Associate's" program will promptly overload and will result in either "I don't work this dept" or "I will get you someone who knows about this" upon which they will depart to never be seen again.
This insidious invasion of our communities is also causing the demise of the local businesses where actual people with actual knowledge about home repair and DIY projects were employed. This is because the targets have more time than spouses to interact with the merchandising community. When targets entered the local business, and were confronted with pertinent technical questions about the project in a language that they could not comprehend, they felt threatened, and so sought the comfort of the place where "any idiot, even your spouse can do it" and technical questions would not be asked by a stupid drone. If they did pick up on a technical term that the spouse had uttered, they could use it and get "that's a good point" and shown even more cheap merchandise to buy.
The only protection against the BORG is for those that dwell with "targets": Never let them enter a BORG, destroy any "Sales Papers" before they enter the living premises, and block all "Home Improvement" channels from the TV reception.
I know that sounds impossible, and once in a while you'll really have to fix something!! (but that leads to a new tool, so guess you have to visit the BORG)

"Resistance is Futile":rotflm::rotflm:

Go
So you have shopped at Home Depot/Lowe's
My daughter calls it Daddy's store...I'm ashamed :lol::lol::lol:


Dave:)
 

Gofor

Mark
Corporate Member
So you have shopped at Home Depot/Lowe's
My daughter calls it Daddy's store...I'm ashamed :lol::lol::lol:


Dave:)
I was seriously considering listing Lowes as a dependent on my tax return, but my brother (who prepares peoples tax returns professionally) said he thought "The IRS might not agree with that classification". I would probably of tried to include HD, but the nearest one is in Rocky Mount, so don't go there much.:rolf:

I have found how to keep LOML out of Lowes, tho. After a couple of stops where I "had to check out the price on this" etc, leading to at least an hour, she won't even go there. She can spend 3 hours in Walmart with her sisters, but won't go to Lowes with me for a 15 minute stop. I am blessed!!

Go
 
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