Choosing between two bench top mortisers

[Alan in Little Washington]

This is not a gloat because there was already a post about my Top Tip that is in the current issue of Wood Magazine.

The prize that came today is a Shop Fox bench top mortiser (W1671). The problem, of sorts, is I already have a Delta (14-650) so I am trying to figure out which one to keep. Here are pics of the two units:

Differences and comments:

Both units were made in China, probably the same factory, so fit and finish is about the same- typical Chinese imports. The aluminum finned motors look identical except for the paint and ratings:

Shop Fox 3/4 hp, 7A, Delta 1/2 hp 5A I have never had a problem with the 1/2 hp bogging down.
Shop Fox 3450 rpm, Delta 1725 rpm The Wood Mag speed chart at this link indicates rpm for drilling wood with a brad point bit of typical mortiser sizes should be 1800 rpm or slower for soft wood, 1200 rpm or slower for hard wood. I know mortising bits are closer to augers but close enough for this comparison. Will a bit running at 3450 create too much heat, over-temp the bit and the chisel? Will the 3450 rpm make smaller, easier-to-clear chips? Or will there be no discernible difference?

Fence mechanisms are similar and not great for either.

Counter balance- both have a single gas spring cylinder.

Head travel:
Shop Fox- 9" , Delta- 5" . Total head travel is not much of an issue to me, though I have a riser on the Delta to make room for a cross-slide vise.

Shop Fox rides on dual tubes, Delta rides on a dovetail metal gib. The Delta is harder to move up and down and the gib is a pain to adjust. The Shop Fox moves MUCH more easily and no adjustment is necessary.

Both have a long handle. The Shop Fox handle is a bit funky and has a lot of slop, but I can easily modify it to fix this.

So what do you guys think? Anyone had much experience with a Shop Fox? Most mortisers run at 1725 rpm. What do you guys think about the Shop Fox 3450 rpm motor? Will it cause overheating of the bit or chisel? Is that a big issue? If it isn't, then the Shop Fox stays and the Delta goes.

 

[KenOfCary]

Are they both direct drive or could the shop fox have some gearing to reduce the drill bit speed?

I'd like to have your problem. I could use a decent mortising machine. Still using an attachment on the drill press.

- Ken.

 

[FredP]

I have a woodtek that spins at 3450. had I bought new I would have preferred the 1725RPM. [got a great deal on it] 3450 is a bit fast for my liking. it cuts wicked fast but there is some burning if i don't do my part.

 

[Alan in Little Washington]

Are they both direct drive or could the shop fox have some gearing to reduce the drill bit speed?

I'd like to have your problem. I could use a decent mortising machine. Still using an attachment on the drill press.

- Ken.

Both are direct drive. Keep watching here- one (or both) will be going on the block soon at a good price(s).

 

[tryingtokeepmyfingers]

I have the simple solution sell both and buy this http://www.amazon.com/Powermatic-1791310-PM701-Horsepower-Mortiser/dp/B000BX1JQU

 

[Alan in Little Washington]

I have the simple solution sell both and buy this http://www.amazon.com/Powermatic-1791310-PM701-Horsepower-Mortiser/dp/B000BX1JQU

I would do that but the value of both the new SF and my old Delta added together, doesn't add up to the cost of a new PM701 even if I were to throw in my cross-slide vise and chisels!

 

[tryingtokeepmyfingers]

I would do that but the value of both the new SF and my old Delta added together, doesn't add up to the cost of a new PM701 even if I were to throw in my cross-slide vise and chisels!

Then the solution is sell the shop fox and then put the money in a envelope and hang it from the delta and then every time you use your mortise pay yourself 10c or 25c for each hole you mortise your own personal savings account to make up the difference and if you watch Amazon the price rises or falls (I got mine new for 385 shipped off amazon in feb of this year ) or maybe you will find one used

 

[jhreed]

I bought my Delta off Raliegh C/L $50.00. Looks new excep for a little rust on one chisel. Bits and chisels are sharp. Do not think it was ever used. The speed of the SF sounds crazy. I would sell the new SF. You will get more money for the new machine and will still have the best of the two in your shop.
James

 

[Bill Clemmons]

Alan, it sounds like you plan to sell at least one of the two. Two things lead me to suggest keeping the Delta: 1) You're not unhappy w/ it, and 2) I think a new Shop Fox would be easier to sell than a used Delta.

Bill

 

[scsmith42]

Alan, it sounds like you plan to sell at least one of the two. Two things lead me to suggest keeping the Delta: 1) You're not unhappy w/ it, and 2) I think a new Shop Fox would be easier to sell than a used Delta.

Bill

+1. The bottom line is that both will do the job, so keep the one that you're the most comfortable with. If it were me, I would keep the Delta (which I already have the same model, thanks to BobbyG!)

General and Powermatic both make some nice large motrisers though....

 

[Alan in Little Washington]

Hey, thanks guys!

A number of Shop Fox users on another forum reported absolutely no problems with its higher speed. I know I can probably clean, re-lube, and re-adjust the ways and gibs on the Delta so it slides better, but right out of the box, the Shop Fox moves up and down sooooo much better and never needs adjustment so I decided to keep it.

If I did more mortising, I would sell both and opt for the PM701 but I'd likely piddle the money away before I got around to buying it. The decision would have been much easier if I had received cash instead of the mortiser.

As soon as I take some pics and figure out a price, I'll be listing the Delta here. I need to decide whether to sell it with the bits/chisels (the Shop Fox only came with only one 1/2" bit/chisel) and the cross-slide vise (I saved the original fence).

In case any Shop Fox W1671 (also G9976) owners are interested in my fix for the sloppy handle- I plan to drill and tap a hole in the moveable hub for a big setscrew, star knob, or adjustable lever knob to lock the handle. The handle shaft already has a flat in that area. If it holds as well as I expect, I'll probably remove the two little stop collars from the shaft since they don't do much anyway. This should allow me to more quickly and easily adjust, firmly lock, or remove the handle. (maybe I'll suggest it to Grizzly :wwink: ).

I outfitted my Delta with a modified cross slide vise. It works but I don't like the action of the cheap HF vise which has slop in the gibs and ways and backlash in the lead screws. I will likely get another vise, but strip it down to vise jaws and the "in - out" sliding portion. I'll remove the lower L -R sliding section and mount the upper parts to a homemade linear bearing. That should:

• Continue to provide good clamping and eliminate the need for the hold-down
• Continue to provide good, easy-to-adjust "in- out" positioning, and eliminate the need for the standard fence
• Allow quick and smooth hand operated L - R travel. I found using a crank for L - R positioning too slow so I removed it from my vise early on, however, I could never get the vise to slide as freely as I wanted.

When I finally get around to it, I'll post a write-up and photos.

 

[merrill77]

So what do you guys think? Anyone had much experience with a Shop Fox? Most mortisers run at 1725 rpm. What do you guys think about the Shop Fox 3450 rpm motor? Will it cause overheating of the bit or chisel? Is that a big issue? If it isn't, then the Shop Fox stays and the Delta goes.

I have the Shop Fox. I, too, was worried about burning with the higher speed. But in practice, I have not found it to be a problem. The higher bit speed is capable of cutting very fast. If you go fast, the bit stays cool as it is cutting into fresh wood. If I need to go slow, I simply plunge out occasionally to give the bit a chance to cool. Overall, I like it. The dual columns are very stiff and the movement is smooth. The generous plunge depth can be handy :> I've mostly used it in oak. It plunges through with plenty of power (1/2" chisel) and little or no burning.

 

[Alan in Little Washington]

I have the Shop Fox. I, too, was worried about burning with the higher speed. But in practice, I have not found it to be a problem. The higher bit speed is capable of cutting very fast. If you go fast, the bit stays cool as it is cutting into fresh wood. If I need to go slow, I simply plunge out occasionally to give the bit a chance to cool. Overall, I like it. The dual columns are very stiff and the movement is smooth. The generous plunge depth can be handy :> I've mostly used it in oak. It plunges through with plenty of power (1/2" chisel) and little or no burning.

Thanks! That seems to be the general consensus among those who own a SF.