Questions on fine tuning my table saw

[lottathought]

Here is the story.
I realized that I was not getting anything close to sq out of a cut on my tablesaw and
spent time last weekend aligning the table fence and blade.

Things got no better. I discovered however that the saw was not the problem, my
Incra 1000 was out of square.

In fact, it took an entire washer behind one side to bring it back to square.
This helped a lot..and at first I thought it was perfect..but it seems to go from perfect
cuts to almost perfect cuts at random.
The miter seems to be correct and I believe the table saw is dead on.

So how perfect can I expect consistent cuts to be when measured by an engineers sq.?
Are there any suggestions to do a greater fine tune?

I am already using a clamp to keep the wood from sliding during a cut.

 

[Joe Scharle]

Need to know what kind of TS you have. Name brand, cabinet/contractor. Some saws can't be fine tuned.

 

[Travis Porter]

Depends on how accurate your square is, but on a decent saw with a decent fence with a decent miter gauge you should get excellent cuts.

You put a washer behind your fence, but did you just hide a different probem? I have only seen one or two Incra's, but do you have the mechanism set parallel to the miter slots? Have you validated that the saw blade is parallel to the miter slots with at 90 and 45 degrees?

If you don't have one, I suggest going to harbor freight and getting a dial indicator and stand. It may not be the most accurate indicator on the market, but you are measuring variance, not absolute distances, and it should work well for that.

 

[DIYGUY]

Here is the story.
I realized that I was not getting anything close to sq out of a cut on my tablesaw and
spent time last weekend aligning the table fence and blade.

Things got no better. I discovered however that the saw was not the problem, my
Incra 1000 was out of square.

In fact, it took an entire washer behind one side to bring it back to square.
This helped a lot..and at first I thought it was perfect..but it seems to go from perfect
cuts to almost perfect cuts at random.
The miter seems to be correct and I believe the table saw is dead on.

So how perfect can I expect consistent cuts to be when measured by an engineers sq.?
Are there any suggestions to do a greater fine tune?

I am already using a clamp to keep the wood from sliding during a cut.

I would check the undercarriage for a loose trunnion. I assume that you have no play at all in the fence and the miter slots? And that there is no sawdust being trapped between the fence and the work? When you are ripping do you see any signs of the blade heeling?

 

[Mike Davis]

I agree with DIYGUY, inconsistent results means something is loose.

I would check everything for loose bolts as well as the miter guide to slot fit.

Something is moving, you should be able to find it and lock it down.

 

[lottathought]

Thanks guys.
It is a TS3650 from Ridgid.

Yes, the fence and miter are tight.

I will look at the undercarriage but I believe that it is all tight.

 

[Joe Scharle]

Neighbor has that saw and the only problem I know of is; his motor pulley got loose and the vibration may have caused a rear trunnion bolt to loosen. Good saw and will tune up.

 

[Gofor]

I have the TS3650 and have no problems using the Osborne Excalibur. I did have to tighten all 6 trunnion bolts when I got it, though as they were only hand tight. If they are loose, make sure you recheck the blade-to-miter-slot alignment.

On my saw, I had to open the ends of the miter slot a little (used a flat bastard file) because they would pinch the bar on the miter gauge when it was set to slide smoothly through the rest of the slot. If there is any side play in the miter gauge, make sure you always keep pressure to the same side of the miter slot to get consistent cuts. I always put the pressure to the outside (away from the blade) for two reasons. First, if my hand slips, it will be moving it away from the blade. Second, the resistance caused by the blade hitting the wood will tend to rotate the tail of the wood to the outside, so if the gauge is already against it, it can't move farther. (However, the wood can still rotate off the miter slot fence on the outside, so a firm grip or clamp may be necessary. This tendency will increase with a dull blade or feeding too fast on a high-tooth-count blade).

How much is the inconsistency on the cuts? I do not have the Incra, but if you had to shim it, it sounds to me that something is wrong, unless the washers are originally part of the adjustment set up.

Go

 

[FredP]

I have that miter gauge and if I recall it is adjustable. make sure the saw is right first.:icon_thum do you have the incra manual? if not I will look for mine but no guarantee I'll find it.

 

[Skymaster]

that incra 1000 IS adjustable WITHOUT washers! Agree something sounds loose.
There are 2 allen screws just behind the fence that attach the fence to the miter body, you loosen them and adjust the fence

 

[cpowell]

The manual shows how to calibrate the fence to 90 degrees. http://www.incra.com/manuals/mg1000.pdf Of course, if you tried to calibrate and couldn't get there then that points to a TS alignment/setup problem.

You shouldn't need to use a washer on an Incra product.

As for precision. The Incra products are very good. I have a V-27, a lesser gauge than your miter 1000. When I bought mine new I adjusted the slot wheels and calibrated the gauge to 90 degrees it worked okay but had some backlash/slop. I contacted Taylor Design group (Incra) and they sent me a replacement to eliminate the slop. It is just dead on now. Before the modified piece there was noticeable variation in a 90 degree cut.

If you can wiggle your gauge when it is in the miter slot then it is not as good as it can be. You should be able to calibrate to 90 degrees, but if there is slop you may want to contact Taylor Design Group. They are top notch, or they were the last time I contacted them.


Chuck

 

[Bas]

Thanks guys.
It is a TS3650 from Ridgid.

Yes, the fence and miter are tight.

I will look at the undercarriage but I believe that it is all tight.

My saw (JET JPS-10) has been "off" ever since I moved. Not so much it's obvious, but enough I noticed slight errors. So I finally got around to making a new jig this evening to slide the dial indicator along the miter slot, and whaddayaknow, the far end blade is off almost .008" to the right! This shouldn't be too hard to adjust (everything can be done from the top), but that's for tomorrow night.

So thanks for posting, finally got me motivated to check my saw :icon_thum

(BTW, a drum sander is perfect for making miter runners out of hardwood fit _exactly :tool

 

[lottathought]

I had some things come up and could not get to the saw last night.
I will be going back in to check it out tonight however.
You have given me some things to check and I will let you know what I find.

 

[lottathought]

Well I think I found it.
I have made a few good cuts. I will make some more to be certain but I think I finally got it,
It WAS the Incra Miter 1000.
The trunnions were all tight in the saw and the blade still appeared to be very much aligned.

I think that there may have been a slight flex in that washer which was giving me at least part of the trouble.
I was not aware how much play that the 3 main mounting screws on the Incra allowed for adjustment.
Also..up until today, I had always tried to align the miter to the T slots in the table.
This made have allowed for a little extra slop as I also aligned the blade with the T-slots.
This time I made sure the blade was aligned to the tracks and then aligned the miter to the blade with an engineers square.
It appears to now be dead on.

Although I like the shooting board, it will be nice to not do any more workouts on it.

Many thanks all