Mortise and Tenons

[leftoflefty]

So my sister asked me to make her a coffee table for her new house. And before I go and start tearing up nice wood for this project, I would like to practice making some M&T joints on a couple of tables for some new tools I have recently purchased.

Does anyone have any suggestions on a good way to lay out M&T joints and the best way to cut them?

Thanks in advance for any words of wisdom.:thumbs_up

 

[DaveO]

Wow there might be a million ways to cut a M&T joint. Personally I like to use my powered mortiser to cut the mortises, and then I use a dado blade on the ts to cut my tenons, and sneak up on a tight fit.
The general rule of thumb for hand cut M&T is 1/3...1/4" mortise/tenon, and a 1/4" cheek/wall on either side, if using 3/4" stock. But if you aren't hand chiseling, like me, you can go up to a 3/8" mortise/tenon because you don't need as much side wood to level your chisel against.
Many folks drill the mortise out first and then clean it up with a bench chisel. Some go all cave-man and knock it out with a mortise chisel alone.
Some cut the tenon on the bandsaw, and other use a handsaw to cut it.
How you do it depends on the tools and skills you have at your disposal.
A marking gauge is going to be your friend when laying out the M&T, you can do without, but being able to set both pins at the correct width and transfer that to all work pieces makes is so much easier.
What tools do you have at your disposal, that might narrow down the advice to something relevant to you.

MTCW,
Dave

 

[leftoflefty]

I've got a TS, 9" BS, router table, marking gauge, drill press. The basics. My TS is just a DeWalt jobsite contractors saw. I'm not even sure its safe to use a dado blade in it. I thought about cutting the shoulders on the TS and the cheeks on the BS. I just picked up a router table today. Thought about maybe cutting the tenons on that.

LOML bought me the plans for Poalini's 3 axis slot mortiser for xmas. I should put that together and use that to cut the mortises. Or i could just go the drill press/chisel route.

I'm not sure about cutting everything by hand. I'm pretty sure it would result in much swearing and frustration.:gar-Bi

 

[bobby g]

What a great gift your wife gave you! You'll love the Greg Paolini mortising machine. If I were you, I'd build it now and skip trying all of the other ways. You can also set it up to cut the tenons or, as Greg often does, you can mortise both pieces (leg and apron) and use loose tenons that you'd be able to make using your table saw and router table.

Have fun and work safely.

bobby g

 

[toolferone]

A couple of thoughts.
Cut your mortise first. It is much easier to make the tenon
Fit the mortise then the other way around.

A good rule of thumb on the fit is to lay a dollar over the mortise
and see if the tenon slips in just smooth by hand with out force.
This allows room for glue somewhere to fit and not lock up and stop the cheek
from seating.

 

[BSHuff]

A mortise chisel is actually rather easy to use once you get the hang of it. Unless you are working in super hard wood, they work nicely even if not silly sharp like a bench chisel. The design of a mortise chisel will hog out that mortise in 2 or 3 passes, at times faster then setting up a mortise machine.

Make sure you always work off of your exposed faces. I leave the pieces with my mortises in them long, and trim to final length after I cut the mortices. That prevents the mortise from splitting while cutting. Mark out your faces and 'gang' mark them. Always use the front face to mark from. I cut my mortises first, then saw the tenons fat on the table saw, making the 'shoulder' cuts all around then hogging off the waste. I have a shoulder plane that I use to pare down the tenons. I like my tenons somewhat 'loose' in the mortises.


Or just say screw it an buy a festool domino :rotflm:

 

[bigcat4t9r]

I use dado stack on TS for tenons and shoulder plane to fit. Mortises get drilled out and chopped with Iles pigstickers and paring chisels. I usually drawbore for strength unless appearances is an issue. For layout, I use mortise gauge and Incra flex square rulers and marking knife. All preceding guidance are excellent tips as well.

I will also chop the entire mortises with the chisels by hand if I'm feeling frisky.

 

[JimD]

The best minimal cost way to cut the mortises I've used is a spiral upcut bit in a plunge router. You can make a simple jig and get very consistent accuracy and your mortises will be smoother than any other way I've cut them. That is not terribly important but it probably adds a little strength.

If you make real consistent mortises with a plunge router and jig, you can cut the tenons to finished width on the table saw. The quickest way is to make a center spacer the right width to space two identical table saw blades apart just the right amount to make the perfect fitting tenon. You can also use a simple jig riding the rip fence to cut the tenons. That is what I usually do. Sometimes I cut the tenons using a dado on either the table saw or the radial arm. I use the radial on long boards - like the cross pieces for a queen sized bed.

If you buy a tool for making mortise and tenons I would buy a shoulder plane first. They are expensive, I have a Stanley which is about the cheapest, but they are a big help. You can easily adjust the shoulders or the tenon thickness to get a great fit. No other tool I've tried makes it as easy to do this well.

The next tool I would buy is a bench top mortiser. That is what I use. It's chisels are 1/4, 3/8, and 1/2. So that is the sized mortises I make. But you can do a good job with no more than a plunge router and spiral upcut bit. You do not have to have the spiral bit but if you don't use one, I would at least get a straight bit with a bottom cutter.

Jim

 

[leftoflefty]

Wow. Thanks guys. As always, your input is vast and greatly appreciated. I'm going to try a few different methods and see which ones work best. I'll keep everyone updated on my progress. Wish me luck.

 

[Joe Scharle]

I'm late to this thread, but I want to point you to another mortising option.

Play the 5 sec video to see.

http://www.solidwoodmachinery.com/Mortisers.htm

And my personal favorite.

http://www.thecraftsmangallery.com/instructionals/instructionals.html

 

[leftoflefty]

I'm late to this thread, but I want to point you to another mortising option.

Play the 5 sec video to see.

http://www.solidwoodmachinery.com/Mortisers.htm

And my personal favorite.

http://www.thecraftsmangallery.com/instructionals/instructionals.html

Never too late Joe. All the help I can get, helps. I'm trying to get some shop time approved by the misses so I can go down and experiment on my M&T methods. :gar-La;

 

[LeftyTom]

Yeah, what they said. :thumbs_up

 

[bob vaughan]

I'm late to this thread, but I want to point you to another mortising option.

Play the 5 sec video to see.

http://www.solidwoodmachinery.com/Mortisers.htm

I've had a couple of the Maka SM6 types. Though I couldn't open the video, I know that they'll do a mortise easily in five seconds, but if the operator adjusts to about six seconds, a slightly better finish will result. If you think a hollow chisel mortiser can be a nuisance to set up, try one of those Makas. One can mortise a single set of table legs by hand almost as quickly. If you've got 40 tables to build, then the Maka is the way to go.

The drill press and hand chisel way is pretty quick in relation to the setup times involved with hollow chisel mortisers and drill press rigs.

 

[Charles Lent]

The Beadlock system is a relatively cheap, simple, and great way for those on a tight budget to do floating tenons and get good results with very little investment. I have an original one that I acquired in a "package deal" and discovered that it is quite simple to use and very accurate. The only additional tools that you need to use with it are a hand drill and the appropriate size drill bit. I already had an FMT and hollow chisel mortise capability, andI use the FMT for almost all of my M & T needs, but one day I decided to play around with the Beadlock and I was very impressed with the results that I obtained. I have since loaned it out a couple of times to friends and they were also impressed with it the results that they got. You can drill a pair of mortises, cut and glue in the tenon stock and have the joint clamped in less than 5 minutes, with only a single layout line across the stock for the location of the center of the mortise, much like you would for a biscuit joint.

Just something else to consider.

Charley

 

[zapdafish]

I like the powered mortiser as well.

I am looking at this for tenons but waiting for some reviews before buying one for myself. The video is pretty amazing.

http://www.bridgecitytools.com/Products/TM-1+Tenonmaker

 

[Jeff]

+1 to all of the suggestions that other members have offered. You want to find a method which is safe, reproducible, and that you're comfortable doing time and again.

Festool sells a "floating tenon" gizmo for about $700, but here's a budget alternative. Click on the pics to see a better description of the "how to" descriptions.

http://thecraftsmanspath.com/2007/09/25/loose-tenon-joinery-budget-alternative-festool-domino/

You can buy the floating tenons if you don't want to make them yourself. I use the jig with a plunge router to cut the mortises & do the tenons on the tablesaw with a dado stack. That's what works for me after several trial & error methods and jigs that I wasn't comfortable or satisfied with. BTW, I still have 8 fingers and 2 thumbs and no stitches.

Good luck on your discovery trail. :dontknow:

So my sister asked me to make her a coffee table for her new house. And before I go and start tearing up nice wood for this project, I would like to practice making some M&T joints on a couple of tables for some new tools I have recently purchased.

Does anyone have any suggestions on a good way to lay out M&T joints and the best way to cut them?

Thanks in advance for any words of wisdom.:thumbs_up