Look what I get to do this weekend

ConwayCustoms

Rory
Senior User
what failed?
Not % sure. SawStop thought the brake cartridge ribbon cable failed, so with the help of another forum member, we replaced that this past Saturday. The saw was experiencing a similar but slightly different issue, after replacing the cable. The light sequence was slightly different, but the issue was still related to the same thing, if that makes sense?

Contact was detected. Just touching the blade with a VERY DRY piece of wood (bought at HD in 2019) changed the solid green light to a solid green light with slow then fast flickering red light. I also tried a total of 3 new brake cartridges. One brake showed the error for, faulty brake, blade rotation is incorrect, and some other issue I don't recall.

Then, their last ditch effort .. They wanted me to replace the arbor block. This is done by removing the entire cast iron top, belts/pulliee, and I don't recall what else. Their PDF is attached in this post, along with the other troubleshooting techniques they had me try.

Shortly after replacing the cartridge cable, my pellet smoker was experiencing severe issues. Long story short, I have a 3rd degree burn on my hand, so I told them there is no way in hell that I will be able to disassemble the entire saw.

The mention of a tech, then asking me to drive the saw 2.5 hrs (1-way) to drop off the saw, so the tech could work on it, etc , surfaced. Such an ordeal.

We tried everything in their books, and other techs chimed in too, then the absolutely last idea surfaced.. change that arbor block!!

nope!

How could a company ask a customer to do something they have absolute no training on, or experience in doing, is beyond me. If they have techs, then most likely those techs have some sort of training on issues like this.

*sigh*
 

drw

Donn
Corporate Member
Rory, sorry that you are continuing to have issues...I am also sorry to learn that SS customer service isn't what I thought it would be.
 

ConwayCustoms

Rory
Senior User
Rory, sorry that you are continuing to have issues...I am also sorry to learn that SS customer service isn't what I thought it would be.
Donn,

Thanks!

They sure had me testing a lot and most/all of their techs were baffled, too.

When they resorted to the very last piece, arbor block, I was done. I just wanted them to take the saw away and try testing it in their warehouse.

I get the financial aspect of this situation, but...

At least I will be receiving a new saw. Now, what do to with it?
 

chris_goris

Chris
Senior User
Not % sure. SawStop thought the brake cartridge ribbon cable failed, so with the help of another forum member, we replaced that this past Saturday. The saw was experiencing a similar but slightly different issue, after replacing the cable. The light sequence was slightly different, but the issue was still related to the same thing, if that makes sense?

Contact was detected. Just touching the blade with a VERY DRY piece of wood (bought at HD in 2019) changed the solid green light to a solid green light with slow then fast flickering red light. I also tried a total of 3 new brake cartridges. One brake showed the error for, faulty brake, blade rotation is incorrect, and some other issue I don't recall.

Then, their last ditch effort .. They wanted me to replace the arbor block. This is done by removing the entire cast iron top, belts/pulliee, and I don't recall what else. Their PDF is attached in this post, along with the other troubleshooting techniques they had me try.

Shortly after replacing the cartridge cable, my pellet smoker was experiencing severe issues. Long story short, I have a 3rd degree burn on my hand, so I told them there is no way in hell that I will be able to disassemble the entire saw.

The mention of a tech, then asking me to drive the saw 2.5 hrs (1-way) to drop off the saw, so the tech could work on it, etc , surfaced. Such an ordeal.

We tried everything in their books, and other techs chimed in too, then the absolutely last idea surfaced.. change that arbor block!!

nope!

How could a company ask a customer to do something they have absolute no training on, or experience in doing, is beyond me. If they have techs, then most likely those techs have some sort of training on issues like this.

*sigh*
Like I said... fancy electronics failing, right? If its not getting power to spin the blade.......How old is this saw?
 

ConwayCustoms

Rory
Senior User
Like I said... fancy electronics failing, right? If its not getting power to spin the blade.......How old is this saw?
I bought the saw May 12, 2020

I wasn't planning on things to go like this but... I had to move 2-3 months later. I had to rent a truck (26') with a lift gate and put the saw in a temp controlled storage unit, for 8 months.

After the 8 months, I rented another 26' truck with liftgate, and moved it into my current home... mid-March, 2021.

May 2nd, 2021, I had a licensed/insured/etc. electrician come over and install the sub-panel.

8:30pm, that same day, I tried to start the saw. Outcome = Christmas tree of lights.. :'(
 

ConwayCustoms

Rory
Senior User
** QUESTION/OPINION **

Once the new saw arrives, should I unbox, then try again, or....

Keep it boxed, sell it, then get something else?

Eyeballing the following: ALPHA HW110S-36P&52P 10" 4HP Dovetail Cabinet Table Saw

Alpha HW110S-36P

It is 4hp, so I would have to upgrade the breaker from 20A to 30A, as well as the wiring from the sub-panel to the outlet. I am not comfortable with doing, so IF I go this route, if anyone would like to assist/offer their abilities, I'd greatly appreciate it as well as do my best to offer a mutually agreed upon "handshake" of sorts.

The distance from the sub-panel to the outlet isn't much, maybe 1' max?


For reference... I am attaching a picture of my sub-panel

Garage Sub Panel.jpg



Still weighing things... NOT an easy decision.


Thanks again!
Rory
 

bob vaughan

Bob Vaughan
Senior User
That seems like a very elegant mechanical design, at least in the artist's rendering. I've see a similar design from Yates back in the 1960s with the dovetail raise/lower. It didn't last.
The nature of sawing wood with a circular blade produces lots of dust and a design like that will be susceptible to dust stoppage faster than traditional designs, at least in my opinion based on past experiences.

1   tablesaw dust - 1.jpg
Yates sliding dovetail design from the 1960s

1   tablesaw dust - 2.jpg
dust in the internals of a saw and yes, this saw had dust collection

1   tablesaw dust - 3.jpg
Build up from resinous woods like pine.

1   tablesaw dust - 4.jpg
The traditional design Unisaw that was working fine despite all the dust.

1   tablesaw dust - 5.jpg
What can happen with doing a lot of dado work and cutting. This volume of debris would have stopped a more elegant design.
 

ConwayCustoms

Rory
Senior User
That seems like a very elegant mechanical design, at least in the artist's rendering. I've see a similar design from Yates back in the 1960s with the dovetail raise/lower. It didn't last.
The nature of sawing wood with a circular blade produces lots of dust and a design like that will be susceptible to dust stoppage faster than traditional designs, at least in my opinion based on past experiences.

View attachment 202157
Yates sliding dovetail design from the 1960s

View attachment 202158
dust in the internals of a saw and yes, this saw had dust collection

View attachment 202159
Build up from resinous woods like pine.

View attachment 202160
The traditional design Unisaw that was working fine despite all the dust.

View attachment 202161
What can happen with doing a lot of dado work and cutting. This volume of debris would have stopped a more elegant design.

Bob...thank you for that information.

If that is a sign, of what could happen with a dovetail system, then I would think it might be best to look elsewhere.

Also, the dado picture is crazy. Doesn't look like like any dust collection was used.

If good/proper DC was used, maybe the dovetail system might be an ok design? I don't know, just asking.

If the dovetail design is more susceptible to dust.. would more care, with regards to dust cleaning, be the only real con to a design like this?

Thanks for the information. Information gathering is always best, before a big purchase, imo.

If the Harvey is a "maybe," what other new saw option/s would you consider? Obviously, considering the same price as what I paid for my SS, or better yet, less.


Thanks again!

Rory
 

Charlie

Charlie
Corporate Member
I have had zero problems with my Grizzly 1023 (Presently priced @ 2050) in over 12 years of use.
I never could see the value of the other over priced makes on the market.
 

ConwayCustoms

Rory
Senior User
If a hobbyist, or 1 person shop ,I could see something between $1,500 - $2,500 (shipped).

Saw the Grizz... Sorry, but still weighing options.
 

bob vaughan

Bob Vaughan
Senior User
Also, the dado picture is crazy. Doesn't look like like any dust collection was used.
Correct. NO dust collection. The saw still works fine. After a run like this, an air hose to the upper internals cleans things up right away. A squirt or two of lube and things are smooth for a year or two. Sawdust soaks up oil so any lubricant is only going to last so long. Wax is a little better but other than topcoat and maybe boshield, I don't know of any in a spray.
The point of that photo is to show what kind of abuse and neglect a traditional design saw is capable of enduring with no real bad effects.
Granted, that photo was of a very unusual situation where I was chewing out lots of wood.
 

Robert166

robert166
Senior User
Dumb question here, ssooooo they are sending you a new SawStop? And you have to send the old one back? If so, you take it apart, box/crate it up and send it back for free? Or do you keep them both? I would assume the box the new one comes in would be used to send damaged one back? Following the thread, you have been very gracious to SawStop, and they have asked waayy more than I would do, after the second time, I would have said send my money back and come get your saw. Hats off to you and your perseverance.
 

Rushton

Rush
Senior User
After looking about recently at options, our community woodworking shop members elected to order a Powermatic 2000B table saw with 3HP motor. Based on recommendations from some other users, and what we could see of the alternatives available (SawStop, Grizzly, et al), this seemed a good match for our needs. Our dealer asked why we weren't ordering the SS instead, and we explained we just didn't want the complexity of all the electronics in the SS. We just wanted a reliable, solid machine with a proven track record for long term service and accuracy. After the OP's story, we're glad we kept it simple. Delivery expected next week.

We'll hook it up to a Clear Vue CV1800 dust collector and see what results we can achieve. I'm not happy about the 4" flex hose inside the cabinet. Haven't yet decided about over-the-table dust collection.
 

ConwayCustoms

Rory
Senior User
Harvey
Dumb question here, ssooooo they are sending you a new SawStop? And you have to send the old one back? If so, you take it apart, box/crate it up and send it back for free? Or do you keep them both? I would assume the box the new one comes in would be used to send damaged one back? Following the thread, you have been very gracious to SawStop, and they have asked waayy more than I would do, after the second time, I would have said send my money back and come get your saw. Hats off to you and your perseverance.
Correct. They HAD to put a $2,500 hold on my Credit Card, before they would move forward. Not happy with that!

I have to disassemble my current SawStop.

Disassemble the following:

Rails, wood panel insert, both side cast iron tables, remove saw from ICS mobile base (which I obviously keep), remove and keep over saw blade dust collection, then keep these items in my garage...where they won't fall and bust on the garage floor, rust, or get damaged... All until the new saw arrives.

I am most likely going to use the pallet they use..with the new saw...as well as the box. Then call SS, so they can then arrange a freight company to come and pick it up.

Once my hand is healed (3rd degree burn on hand from horrible pellet smoker incident that happend later in the same day when I replaced the cartridge cable), I'll get to work.

643412575~2.jpg643412555~2.jpg

They are paying to ship back and once they receive the saw, they're removing the hold for the $2,500."

"Good" thing is, I get to keep all of the brake cartridges they sent.. I think I now have 5?

During this entire ordeal, they constantly said the same..."Thank you for being so patient! Again, you have been fantastic this entire time. We usually don't have calls where a customer has gone through what you have, and still been so patient."

Well, thanks, I guess. Makes me wonder what other customers are saying, when they call in. Lol

I'm just thinking..when I called in, what good would threatening them do...or yelling? Sure, I was livid, but again, what's the point of getting all worked up when they are 2,000+ miles away and I can't go to their storefront..with a hammer and pay their kneecaps a visit?


Still on the fence as to what to do, when the new saw arrives. Debating on keeping or selling it, with all brake cartridges, ICS mobile base, and overhead dust collection.

I'm not sure who else to look at..

Harvey Alpha/Ambassador, Laguna F3, Delta, Jet..?
I want to stay below what I paid for my SS, but I'd also like precision, reliability, good/great warranty, new, and not sure what else. $1,500 - $2,800 (shipped) is a nice budget, I would think.

2hp good, or do I really need 3+? I can't see myself cutting 3"+ thick pieces of wood, but you never know.

Also thinking of just selling everything and forget woodworking...that's how bummed I feel.

*Sigh*

Thanks for the support, reading my struggles, and your comments.

Rory
 

ConwayCustoms

Rory
Senior User
After looking about recently at options, our community woodworking shop members elected to order a Powermatic 2000B table saw with 3HP motor. Based on recommendations from some other users, and what we could see of the alternatives available (SawStop, Grizzly, et al), this seemed a good match for our needs. Our dealer asked why we weren't ordering the SS instead, and we explained we just didn't want the complexity of all the electronics in the SS. We just wanted a reliable, solid machine with a proven track record for long term service and accuracy. After the OP's story, we're glad we kept it simple. Delivery expected next week.

We'll hook it up to a Clear Vue CV1800 dust collector and see what results we can achieve. I'm not happy about the 4" flex hose inside the cabinet. Haven't yet decided about over-the-table dust collection.
Good luck with your PM! I hope it is very reliable and everything you want in a table saw.
 

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