Long-Lasting Luggable For Cub Scouts

LydaRA

New User
LydaRA
I have been the Rocketry Station lead at Webelos Adventure Camp for five years. Yes, you read that correctly, putting explosive black powder in the hands of fourth and fifth graders...

To celebrate, I'm upping the ante: building a custom launch control system.

You see we normally have ten Scouts/LCOs "drag race" their rockets at a time. But that then leaves us struggling to push through enough load/fly/recover cycles to get everyone finished in time to get to their next station of learning & fun. We'll have 20-40 Scouts learn about engineering, rocketry, & safety; and build kits to fly _twice_ every hour. We fly once, talk to them about timing, winds, other factors beyond control that left us scattered about the rocket range....then how to adjust for those factors, and fly again to see the results.

But it takes so long to do at just ten at a time. So let's do twenty, thirty--or more!

I'll be building a set of launch frames that are somewhat of a cross between a sawhorse and an IKEA flat-pack. There will be a crossbeam holding ten sets of electrical box covers as blast deflectors and launch-guiding rods. This will be held up by triangles of plywood on each end, with sections of 2"x4" with slots & bolts sliding along the triangles (allowing extension to pivot the triangles, limiting the tilt to maximum 30 degrees).

The Scouts will drag & drive this launch frame from storage out to the middle of a dirt or grass field (so this will be getting dirty). The days often start with dew on the grass, and Summer storms pop up without warning (so this will be getting wet). And this will be done over and over, day after day, year after year (so this will be getting a lot of wear).

Thus I'm thinking to perhaps make the:
1) Crossbeam out of 6'x2"x8" pressure-treated lumber,
Simple beam, use natural crowning oriented to shed water from the top.
2) Triangle Legs out of marine grade ply,
Water-resistant, even if edges or faces get chewed up a bit.
3) Slotted Leg Extensions out of 2"x4" pressure-treated lumber.
Simple to make, and to replace, as these will have most mechanical wear and tear, and significant load-to-ground contact.

Will be building a couple of these launch frames (so initially setup for 20 rockets at once).

Once this launch frame is ready to go....I'll pair it with a custom electronics system as well....test, then donate to MCC use and enjoyment!

Sorry to be long-winded! But now that you have a sense of what I am trying to achieve, my questions:
1) Does this seem to work well, or what would you change?
2) Where might I source the materials best (I'm donating this, but need to contain the budget, as I am unemployed.)

Many thanks for any and all input!
 

Craptastic

Matt
Corporate Member
Instead of electrical boxes for launch blast deflectors look at the magnetic parts holders that HF sells all the time at $1.99 for the chromed ones. Drill a hole in the center and insert a threaded rod with nuts locking it down and you have adjustable, portable, and likely to last somewhat longer than a fire bombed galvanized electrical box.

Price should be close on a per blast deflector basis too. Have you seen prices and availability of electrical supplies lately?
 

cyclopentadiene

Update your profile with your name
User
That was one of the favorite activities when my son was in scouts.
I was always frustrated with the pinewood derby as I worked with the den leader and all of the den used my shop to build their cars. We taught shop safety etc. but the cars were built by the kids. Every time we went to the actual race the winning cars had never been touched by the kids and looked like works of art. This was about the kids, not the parents
 

LydaRA

New User
LydaRA
Am I too old to come? Man, sounds like fun!!
The more the merrier! Once fully tested and debugged, we may even invite a TV station to camp! We already have BSA National Supply Group asked to come for updated publicity photos.
 

LydaRA

New User
LydaRA
That was one of the favorite activities when my son was in scouts.
I was always frustrated with the pinewood derby as I worked with the den leader and all of the den used my shop to build their cars. We taught shop safety etc. but the cars were built by the kids. Every time we went to the actual race the winning cars had never been touched by the kids and looked like works of art. This was about the kids, not the parents
Yes, I loved Pinewood Derby. Our Pack had an "Outlaws Division," expressly to give the adults somewhere to compete. Hopefully that takes off some of the pressure to interfere in their children's race cars!

But this is a _rocketry_ range! We reduce some of the parental over-reach by having the children build their rocket kits at the camp. So really the competition is more focused on the speed & quality of the children's ability to follow the build sheet directions! And being a more "leveled" competition, the Scouts go on to happily accept the similar performance of the rockets....and yet our post-first-flight discussion of why "identical" rockets are scattered about the range--and how to adjust before our second flights!

Meanwhile, I get to let my inner-engineer glory in this build of new Ground Support Equipment!!!
 

LydaRA

New User
LydaRA
Now I just need to focus on what type and species of wood to use in building these launchpad frames! Anyone have suggestions???
 

JNCarr

Joe
Corporate Member
Having flown MANY rockets as a kid (including 6+ ft. handmade steel tube zinc/sulfur/alcohol which would be considered WoMD now), I'd suggest each section be easily aligned perpendicular to the prevailing wind and have an azimuth adjustable platform to account for wind speed. A couple of simple and cheap saw-horse brackets, treated lumber, a couple of hinges and a homemade brace to lock in the angle would be the way I would go. Drill a hole every 12" in the angle plate to hold the launch rod and blast deflector. For safety, I would include a local key at each station for the "loading officer" to enable only when everyone leaves the station, a key for the "range officer" and a key for the "flight commander" who also gets to push the button. I would include a red light/green light signal at each loading station that is green only when all keys are removed/deactivated.

BTW - I've also built black powder rockets, and can assure you what the scouts are using is not black powder :)
 

kserdar

Ken
Senior User
Do you have pictures of your existing design and materials?
I launched rockets as a kid. But it was one at a time and a purchased launch station.

Maybe with a wish list of materials. People might find scraps of whatever available for free in their shops.
 

LydaRA

New User
LydaRA
Having flown MANY rockets as a kid (including 6+ ft. handmade steel tube zinc/sulfur/alcohol which would be considered WoMD now), I'd suggest each section be easily aligned perpendicular to the prevailing wind and have an azimuth adjustable platform to account for wind speed. A couple of simple and cheap saw-horse brackets, treated lumber, a couple of hinges and a homemade brace to lock in the angle would be the way I would go. Drill a hole every 12" in the angle plate to hold the launch rod and blast deflector. For safety, I would include a local key at each station for the "loading officer" to enable only when everyone leaves the station, a key for the "range officer" and a key for the "flight commander" who also gets to push the button. I would include a red light/green light signal at each loading station that is green only when all keys are removed/deactivated.

BTW - I've also built black powder rockets, and can assure you what the scouts are using is not black powder :)
Indeed. By limiting the length of the slot in the legs, we can ensure that a launch angle of no more than 30 degrees is set. All ten blast deflector plates and holes for the launch rods are fixed flat to the main beam. So the RSO only has to "dial in" pointing the whole frame perpendicular to the wind and legs/the launch angle once for all ten to be good.


As for the electronics....oh my! You should see the modular electronics system I have designed! Six pages of KiCAD electrical schematics, Arduinos, RS485/Modbus networking, RSO "dead man" switch, 10 individual LCO stations (so Scouts control their own launch), 11 removable keys (with anti-jimmy lockouts), launchpad isolated power & lockouts, smart continuity range testing, range strobe/siren, "NASA Apollo-style" time/message display, and embedded system logic (to enforce NAR & RSO standards, even if operated by a volunteer without extensive training)!

Still looking for an electronics professional to review & help turn it into Gerber files so I can order PCBs... Safety requires multiple eyeballs...


But on the woodworking forum....I'm looking for input on the _vastly_ simpler launchpad frame I originally described.
 

JNCarr

Joe
Corporate Member
Indeed. By limiting the length of the slot in the legs, we can ensure that a launch angle of no more than 30 degrees is set. All ten blast deflector plates and holes for the launch rods are fixed flat to the main beam. So the RSO only has to "dial in" pointing the whole frame perpendicular to the wind and legs/the launch angle once for all ten to be good.


As for the electronics....oh my! You should see the modular electronics system I have designed! Six pages of KiCAD electrical schematics, Arduinos, RS485/Modbus networking, RSO "dead man" switch, 10 individual LCO stations (so Scouts control their own launch), 11 removable keys (with anti-jimmy lockouts), launchpad isolated power & lockouts, smart continuity range testing, range strobe/siren, "NASA Apollo-style" time/message display, and embedded system logic (to enforce NAR & RSO standards, even if operated by a volunteer without extensive training)!

Still looking for an electronics professional to review & help turn it into Gerber files so I can order PCBs... Safety requires multiple eyeballs...


But on the woodworking forum....I'm looking for input on the _vastly_ simpler launchpad frame I originally described.
I am an electrical engineer with over 45 years of design experience (I designed an Intel 8008 microprocessor system as a junior in HS) and am well versed in Arduino - all of my clocks run on a custom PWB Arduino based system. If you'd like me to look at it, I am happy to do so. The only thing about your system that seems to need consideration is maintainability. Are you the only one in the troop/pack (I forget which it is at each age and gender) that can maintain it? If so, it will be discarded when your child leaves and it fails (as the old adage says, hardware eventually fails and software eventually works).
 

LydaRA

New User
LydaRA
Ah yes, maintenance! That's why I chose the core tech that I did. UNCC teaches courses with Arduinos. So the local Council should be able to find/hire a work-study student for repairs. And RJ45 Ethernet cabling is a commodity everywhere. The Modbus network signaling is a different use for the same Modbus networking that Honeywell, Trane, Siemens, etc all have woven vertically through Charlotte's high-rise office building control systems. And even though marine plywood is tough, the legs on the launch frame that contact the ground are only held by two thumb-bolts and cut slots--so any Camp Ranger or weekend handyman should be able to cut and drill replacements when they eventually rot.

The software....well that's my profession. And just like systems from my collegiate Senior Research Project (a comprehensive Student Information Database at Wofford College--before data warehousing was common) and so many employer projects since....both self-documented, clean code and comprehensive printed manuals....could be assumed and maintained by any decent coder.

At 50 years old, with bad family genetics....always considering succession planning!

Getting this reviewed and "blessed" by electronics pros, NAR chapter, and BSA Council executives....it should run safely and for a long time....with or without me. It's all for/about the children! :)
 

Premier Sponsor

Our Sponsors

LATEST FOR SALE LISTINGS

Top