Glue testing - "Wood by Wright" - James Wright You Tube video

[Hmerkle]

I found this interesting and thought I would share it for those of you not familiar with this Vlogger (video blogger) James Wright.

Some surprising conclusions in his testing, and it seems very scientific or at least well thought out.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZoaTZY5cSQE

 

[mlzettl]

As many of the folks who commented on this video stated, there are definitely some surprises here. I have used most of the glues mentioned, and I frequently use Titebond 2 and 3, West Systems epoxy, all types of CA, and occasionally liquid hide glue. Recently I have been thinking that I need to use more hide glue, especially on my better furniture pieces, primarily because of the ability to repair it down the road. These results certainly reinforce the use of hide glue. Also, as many noted, CA glue has some shortcomings that were not really tested, and I have noted failures in various situations that I cannot really quantify. All in all, this video is time well spent, and I am grateful for the link.

Matt

 

[Hmerkle]

As many of the folks who commented on this video stated, there are definitely some surprises here. I have used most of the glues mentioned, and I frequently use Titebond 2 and 3, West Systems epoxy, all types of CA, and occasionally liquid hide glue. Recently I have been thinking that I need to use more hide glue, especially on my better furniture pieces, primarily because of the ability to repair it down the road. These results certainly reinforce the use of hide glue. Also, as many noted, CA glue has some shortcomings that were not really tested, and I have noted failures in various situations that I cannot really quantify. All in all, this video is time well spent, and I am grateful for the link.

Matt

Yes, I was suspicious of CA being used in an exterior situation as I always thought water would break-down cured CA glue...
I think it would be fun to throw "failures in various situations" back at James and see if he can replicate them.

 

[danmart77]

I have used most of the glues mentioned, and I frequently use Titebond 2 and 3, West Systems epoxy, all types of CA, and occasionally liquid hide glue.

Hey Matt
Just wondering about T2 and T3. I worked briefly in a shop where the boss insisted on using both of the Titebond "water resistant" glues on everything. He was convinced they did a better job than the "original" Titebond glue.

Truth be known, I ruined a bunch of clothing doing large glue ups.

Glue and water? I go to epoxy and skip the debate on T2 and T3. I used West products for years but found the boatbuilders I talk with have all gone to the RAKA epoxy for cost reasons and they claim it works just as well as the West stuff.

Wondered what your thoughts are on outdoor use of glues other than epoxies?

 

[JimD]

Interesting. Did you notice he mis-spelled Glue (it says Clue) on the opening slide? Doesn't matter. It's surprising that hide glue did so well and Titebond II and III did so poorly exterior.

 

[bob vaughan]

About the only good exterior woodworking glue I know of is resorcinol, but successful use does put a lot of responsibility on the woodworker.

https://www.christinedemerchant.com/adhesive-glue-resorcinol.html

 

[Gofor]

Interesting data on the 3M 5200. I used it when I had a boat in Florida. I found it very good for use with fiberglass, especially if you want it to be a tough adhesive that also doubles as a sealer caulk and was pretty much impervious to oils and fuels. For stuff that I wanted permanent, marine-tex epoxy was my go-to. (A friend of mine always said "marine-tex is for-e-ver!" I think the 5200 was designed for impervious surfaces, such as metal and fiberglass, not for raw wood.

Anyway, good info. Thanks Hank.

Go

 

[mlzettl]

For outdoor use, I have used epoxy, Titebond 3, and resorcinol. In the applications that I have used them, I have not had failures. Admittedly, I do not recall using any of these glues in a truly extreme situation where they are underwater for extended periods, etc. Also, in almost every situation, there is some type of surface coating used as well, most commonly paint. That obviously helps. Resorcinol is really messy to work with, and I have not used it in many years. I have also used 3M 5200, but I have used that more as a high strength sealant as opposed to a "wood glue." I don't think it was really meant to be used in that way, and with the exception of small, low stress joining of non-porous materials, parts are usually mechanically fastened as well. I have not used the RAKA epoxy, but it sounds like it would be worth a try, as the West Systems is quite pricey.

Dan commented, "Hey Matt, Just wondering about T2 and T3." I use both of these routinely for interior use. I use T3 on cutting boards, etc. where there is frequent water exposure. I have always thought that T3 was a bit stronger, but for the majority of interior applications, T2 is quite sufficient. Again, I am thinking that hide glue may be the best option for high quality, heirloom type pieces that may need repair sometime down the road.

Matt

 

[Sp00ks]

I had a good conversation with him on Reddit about his experiment. I really have nothing to add to this thread but he seems like a very nice guy. We discussed the CA results quite a bit as I was surprised as he was. We both agreed that longevity of the CA was the real question and neither of us had 20 years to wait around.

 

[Hmerkle]

So from our discussion - I think we can suggest another test - James can get some RAKA Epoxy for a future test.
Thank you Dan for mentioning an option to the West system.

"you are welcome" to everyone who said thanks for posting - I enjoy sharing information like this as we all have biased ideas about stuff and it was great to see objective data for some of mine and some of the surprises that came from his testing!

I was suckered by the gorilla glue and have used it in multiple situations - the oddest was to glue a sole back on a shoe! (My bias is that worked better than when I was using it for gluing wood.) I just thought I was doing something wrong, but the bond didn't seem as good as I thought it would be. Now my bias has some data to back it up!

 

[danmart77]

Again, I am thinking that hide glue may be the best option for high quality, heirloom type pieces that may need repair sometime down the road.
Matt

I have written quite a bit here on the site about hide glue. You can search around and find the discussions if you are considering repairable joinery(guitars, chairs and veneer work).

Yes liquid hide glue is a good choice but its not going to help you get the most from hide glue. What?

Hide glue flakes come in a number of gram strengths. This is critical when matching glue to job.

Liquid hide from Olde Brown glue bottle made by Patrick Edwards is 192 gram strength. Franklin... I don't know.

I don't want to say the word "lazy" and insult someone who sees it as "convenient" but making your own liquid hide glue is easy and inexpensive. You will also learn as you go. Some times I buy apple pies and other times I make my own.

Good luck with hide glue and have some fun with the stuff. Its a different learning curve but I think it is worth the time.

A simple drawer front can become interesting with 30 minutes of veneer work.

​

More photos of veneer work in the Gallery in folder Veneer Work.

​

 

[Hmerkle]

Dan,
I thought of you right away when I was watching James' video.
You Have been touting the wonders of hide glue for some time.

For me, Hide glue and "making your own liquid hide glue is easy and inexpensive" are not in the same universe.

There is this mystique around the "old master's techniques" (shellac, Hide glue etc.) that you are bringing to light and I wanted to take a second and tell you that I appreciate that.

On an alternative thought - what I really like about NCWW is "one thread leads to another" I know we have some [a lot] of topic drift in posts, but sometimes that is good. by posting the video, it had you say "making your own hide glue is easy and inexpensive." I think that takes away from the mystique and lets members who are interested know there is someone to go to for questions on this process.