Electrical options of r setting up a new shop

Jerome B

New User
Jerome
I am moving my shop into a new space, the garage at my new house. I am looking at options of what to do about electricity, and I am trying to think long term. The garage is detached from the house. I am wondering which is the better option. 1.Run a line from the house fuse panel (200 amp) or to have duke power drop a line to the shop.
I don't usually use many power tools, but I wan to leave myself an option for the future. Also how do folks get wifi to their detached shops?

I hope to be able to run the usual:
Heat/AC
lots of lights
table saw
lathe (220 outlet)
band saw
dust collection
compressor

Thanks,
Jerome
 

Bill Clemmons

Bill
Corporate Member
First question: Do you ever plan to use the shop as a business, or will it be strictly hobby? If it will ever be a business, I suggest a separate meter and panel. That way you will know exactly how much you're spending on power to operate your business.

If just a hobby, my main concern w/ running a line from the house would be the power drop over the distance from house to garage.

My shop is about 200' from the house and I chose to go w/ a separate line and meter.
 

blackhawk

Brad
Corporate Member
I had the same situation and I ran a separate line to my detached garage. I put in a 200 amp service. I am in Virginia and have Appalachian Power. I pay between $13 and $16 per month for the garage. I park cars in mine and only use it for my planer.
 

Jerome B

New User
Jerome
I am a bit worried about the power drop and I like the idea aoaf having a seperate bill. Was it prohibitively expensive to get the separate line?
 

blackhawk

Brad
Corporate Member
I think it cost me between $300 and $400 to run the line from the pole to the meter. I had it buried and that was about 18 years ago. If you only have a 200 amp service to your house, I would definitely recommend adding a separate service to the garage.
 

MarkE

Mark
Corporate Member
On internet/wireless access: how far is the shop from the house?

My shop is a detached building, but it is very close to the house. I ran a 150 foot, outdoor rated, cat6a ethernet cable from my home office in the house to the shop building. I have an 8 port ethernet switch and a wireless access point in the shop.
 

Rwe2156

DrBob
Senior User
The shop itself is not that demanding. I ran my shop for many years off a 60A subfeed from the house including a 5HP compressor.

AC is the really big determiner. That depends on the size of the shop. A 3or 4 ton heat pump alone you're looking at least 100A. Might not be doable as a subfeed from house depending on your load center.

Looking forward IMO you're better off with a separate service if the budget is in place for another electric bill. It also a selling point if you ever decide to relocate.

Not familiar with your area, but it wasn't cheap & this type work really should be done by a licensed electrician. I had a 200A service run to my shop/barn a few years ago, anticipating one day having central air. I was not cheap - $4500.

Electricity runs about $60/mo with no AC.
 

chris_goris

Chris
Senior User
A dedicated service (meter and box) is dependent on where your existing power is, how much "extra" capacity you have as well as physical location of the new shop. Your provider will gladly tell you the best options for your needs. Get them involved, theyre alot better to deal with than you may think!. Mine ran 250' of buried cable to my shop for "free". I say free but I have a separate meter and bill that has the same basic delivery charges every month my house does. But, my useage is very low, the entire bill is about $50/mo, but I just put in a Heat pump so Im anxiously awaiting to see how that affects the bottom line.
 

tvrgeek

Scott
User
Yo always need more power. I wish I had the feed so I could have a 5 HP dust collector at least. 3 HP is enough for me on my other tools. I have only 100A.
My panel is too small. Not total load, but in branches. I would prefer my tools were each on a separate run. 220 breakers take 2 slots, compared to putting in 4 half size 20A 110's. Don't forget outside lights and GFI outlets.
All your 110 should be 20A unless you have a DeWalt 735 planer. Or just for good measures, put in one 30A 110 line. ( I would if I can figure out how to get a full size breaker in a full panel)
All my outlets are quads, but I still have a couple power strips.
Never enough light. Figure out what you want and double it.
Plan where your ambient sir clearer will hang.
Modern split HVAC systems are amazing in temp range and efficiency, but they don't de-humidify. I have t run a separate de-humidifier. I put in a 30A but only needed 20. Pretty darn big building. Talk to your HVAC guy to plan.
I planned on ceiling fans, but as my ambient cleaner is an old furnace filter, it blows far more than ceiling fans, and clean air
Here is the big one. I really wish I had run a conduit under the floor to my table saw. I also wish I had run a 6 inch dust collector duct to it too. Someday, I may rent a big concrete saw and do it. If you know your shop layout, I would run ALL my DC under the floor!

I had a professional do the panel and feed from the house. Not too expensive. Then I did the shop. As I have done a lot, and I have read the code, I had no issues with the inspector. As I had a pole barn and wall wiring was exposed, I used armored cable. Not hard if you get a couple of the right tools. Thinwall is not much harder. If you can run in the walls, far easier.

A lot of folks like to run their shop with one gauge size larger than code. It sure does not hurt.

I wish I had wired internet as my wi-fi is flakey. Too many walls and even with a repeater it is not great.
 

Oka

Casey
Corporate Member
Like others have stated put a 200 amp panel to supply the power. The cost for the panel is 100 bucks more than a 100 amp panel +/-. When I lived in Calif I installed a 400 amp main and 2- 200 amp metered supply panels to my home.
Whether it is coming from under ground or overhead usually, those wires have to up size, as well as your wire from the mast to feed the main. Usually 2/0 copper or 4/0 for alum. Personally never liked aluminum wire/cable, but it is cheaper. If you look around at used building supply places, might get lucky and find the supply drop wire for a deal.
 

lspooz

Larry
Corporate Member
As dedicated BEV driver for a decade (battery electric vehicle, NO gas ever and now on my second Nissan LEAF) I'd recommend adding wiring for at least one 220V 40-50 amp Level-2 EV charger if you will have a car parked in/near the garage - if panel is full you most likely would only charge at night/when tools not being used.
Much cheaper and easier to add one ahead of time, and you probably will eventually need it for either your main car or your second car
 

jfynyson

Jeremy
User
If you do by chance run power from the house to the garage AND wish to run the suggest Cat6 cable for internet from the house then it's suggested that the internet cable is buried in a separate line with at least 12" separation from the power lines & and even more if possible to mitigate electrostatic interferences.
 

Gofor

Mark
Corporate Member
Lots of good info so I will only add a few things I don't see mentioned to add to your wish list, to be pared down as finances dictate:

"You can never have too many outlets". I recommend at least a duplex outlet every 4' run of wall (20A circuits). In my shop, I put in double duplex, with each duplex in the double box on separate circuits. I can plug the15A vac and the 15A saw into the same location but different circuit, minimizing the cord tripping hazard. More outlets does not mean you need more power. The power needed is based on what you realistically think you will have plugged in and running at the same time on the same circuit, not the number of outlets installed. Some will end up rarely being used, but its easier to install at the beginning than add on later.

In the ceiling, install duplex outlets instead of light fixtures. That way you can plug in multiple LED light bars, located exactly where you need them (most have a 5' cord), allowing for spot lighting for a workbench, etc. and general lighting for the shop area. If you use 12ga wire and a 20A circuit, the outlets also give you the ability to drop down power to a machine not near a wall.

For the 220v equipment, put at least one 220v 30A outlet on each wall to allow relocating in the future. (For any 40A or 50A circuits, might one to preplan those for the best location for that item).

Install some outside receptacles, and also a circuit for exterior lighting at each corner.

If you do go with a separate power service, AND you use a portable generator as your emergency power during outages, consider putting in a transfer switch for it at the garage. The shop will be a great way to exercise the generator every month or so, and thus ensure you have a good useable unit when the need arises. They need to be run under load for an hour or so to keep the windings dried out, as well as you need to keep the fuel from degrading (i.e gasoline or diesel).

Just a few thoughts to consider.
 

Langd002

Scott
Senior User
I am moving my shop into a new space, the garage at my new house. I am looking at options of what to do about electricity, and I am trying to think long term. The garage is detached from the house. I am wondering which is the better option. 1.Run a line from the house fuse panel (200 amp) or to have duke power drop a line to the shop.
I don't usually use many power tools, but I wan to leave myself an option for the future. Also how do folks get wifi to their detached shops?

I hope to be able to run the usual:
Heat/AC
lots of lights
table saw
lathe (220 outlet)
band saw
dust collection
compressor

Thanks,
Jerome
I am in Efland NC (Orange County) with Piedmont Electrical Membership Co-op. Last year I build a new stand-alone shop. Originally my electrician suggested installing a 60A or 100A sub panel but I was concerned about not having enough amperage. I talked with PEMC and my electrician about options and PEMC offered to upgrade my house service from 200A to 400A for free. The less expensive option was for PEMC to upgrade the service and hire my electrician to dig a trench from my house to the new shop and run 200A. So PEMC dug a trench, installed new wire, and replaced the meter on the house. Electrician divided the 400A to 200A for the house and 200A to the shop. This cost slightly more that running a new service to the shop but I will save money after 4 years only having to pay for 1 service each month.
 

Skymaster

Jack
Senior User
I would make ALL 110 outlets 20A. Run nothing less than 12ga for all outlets, strictly lights you can go 15a especially leds
 

Gotcha6

Dennis
Corporate Member
I think it cost me between $300 and $400 to run the line from the pole to the meter. I had it buried and that was about 18 years ago. If you only have a 200 amp service to your house, I would definitely recommend adding a separate service to the garage.
Check with your power company about this. Many of them will run a cost analysis for overhead vs. underground service, and if it is cheaper to go underground, there's no upcharge. They are usually obligated to go overhead, but they also prefer underground for maintenance purposes (no tree limbs to worry about).
 

Jerome B

New User
Jerome
Y'all are a wealth of great information. I am in Graham, so I will have Duke Energy. Sounds like it is time to call Duke Energy and get an idea of what option they want to offer. I decided to wait on expanding the shop to make sure that I had the budget to outfit building well. I am glad that I had made that decision. Now I just have to figure out how to store my stash of wood. It is will take up too much space in the shop. Thanks guys
 

Dreuxgrad

Ed
Senior User
Y'all are a wealth of great information. I am in Graham, so I will have Duke Energy. Sounds like it is time to call Duke Energy and get an idea of what option they want to offer. I decided to wait on expanding the shop to make sure that I had the budget to outfit building well. I am glad that I had made that decision. Now I just have to figure out how to store my stash of wood. It is will take up too much space in the shop. Thanks guys
JB -I c u turn up many places. We decided to start the search, but not moving back to NC
 

Gotcha6

Dennis
Corporate Member
Y'all are a wealth of great information. I am in Graham, so I will have Duke Energy. Sounds like it is time to call Duke Energy and get an idea of what option they want to offer. I decided to wait on expanding the shop to make sure that I had the budget to outfit building well. I am glad that I had made that decision. Now I just have to figure out how to store my stash of wood. It is will take up too much space in the shop. Thanks guys
Do you have room for a shipping container? Zoning/HOA restrictions?
 

junquecol

Bruce
User
A stand alone meter for shop changes your rate from residential to commercial. First you have (with Duke) a $26 a month meter charge, whether you use and electricity or not. Then commercial rates are higher than residential. Plus, because you have a second meter, the NC Dept of Revenue will be breathing down your back as to whether you are operating a business, to which they want a cut as sales taxes. You can buy your own meter, and have it installed in feed from house. That's what we did on our rental as the well pump, fed from that house, supplies more than one house. Read the meter every month, and give tenant a credit for cost of electricity, usually less than three bucks a month
 

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