3D Printed Table Saw Dust Collection

[beloitdavisja]

An interesting watch as this guy alters his tablesaw's dust collection with 3D printed parts. He's in Germany, and using a generic chinese manufactured saw, so the parts aren't applicable to what's available here, but I liked watching the problem solving that he goes through. While it's not perfect, it's a big improvement over the stock dust collection and suits his need as a hobbyist.

 

[HITCH-]

He went into a lot of detail to show what he did
I wonder if it would be more effective if it was wider or even angled to where the bottom was wider than the top

 

[Echd]

A 3d printer is an invaluable tool for the garage or wood shop and even the cheap ones nowadays are pretty darn good. I've had prusas, ratrigs, built a voron 0, but I picked up an open box ender 3 v3 ke last year for barely $120 and it's fantastic. I don't think it has ever failed a print and it just works.

If you like fiddling, there is so much you can do with a printer. Jigs, inserts, repair parts, just generally very useful, and the knowledge largely transfers to and from cnc machines as well.

 

[Henry W]

A 3d printer is an invaluable tool for the garage or wood shop and even the cheap ones nowadays are pretty darn good. I've had prusas, ratrigs, built a voron 0, but I picked up an open box ender 3 v3 ke last year for barely $120 and it's fantastic. I don't think it has ever failed a print and it just works.

If you like fiddling, there is so much you can do with a printer. Jigs, inserts, repair parts, just generally very useful, and the knowledge largely transfers to and from cnc machines as well.

@Echd or others
I have SOME basic familiarity with a 3d printer, as I have colleagues that use it at work. What little I do know is all related to that one machine. That would not give me the confidence to buy an open box machine (like I would for a wood working tool).

So for a programming novice like me that might like to explore this for WW jig making, what would you consider the important features to look for or know about? Print size and resolution I understand - what else should I look for?

 

[Wilsoncb]

This guy has fewer resources than the big machine makers. The big advantage they have is they already have the cad models. So I have to ask why wouldn’t they do at least as good as this guy?
Don’t have the resources? Nope
Don’t want to add cost? Probably, and as long as the competition doesn’t do much better, why add cost. Which leads me to the next question.
Are most of the US companies using the same designs? Probably.
Don’t want to pay for development? Yep.

Sawstop had to make their own saws because the other manufacturers didn’t think people would pay more for safety. So obviously they wouldn’t think people would pay even slightly more for better dust collection. Better DC might not actually cost anymore if the current parts being used were just improved.

 

[beloitdavisja]

A 3d printer is an invaluable tool for the garage or wood shop and even the cheap ones nowadays are pretty darn good. I've had prusas, ratrigs, built a voron 0, but I picked up an open box ender 3 v3 ke last year for barely $120 and it's fantastic. I don't think it has ever failed a print and it just works.

If you like fiddling, there is so much you can do with a printer. Jigs, inserts, repair parts, just generally very useful, and the knowledge largely transfers to and from cnc machines as well.

Agree! I got my 3d printer a year ago to work on this project. It's an Ender 3 V2 Neo and I've used it for much more than I thought I would. I bought it for about $200 at the time and have since done a few upgrades, most recently replacing the hot-end to an all metal one (Creality Spider 2.0).

I have SOME basic familiarity with a 3d printer, as I have colleagues that use it at work. What little I do know is all related to that one machine. That would not give me the confidence to buy an open box machine (like I would for a wood working tool).

So for a programming novice like me that might like to explore this for WW jig making, what would you consider the important features to look for or know about? Print size and resolution I understand - what else should I look for?

You'd be surprised that the little you know will transfer quite well to other machines.
My printer uses Cura for the software slicer. I could also use other slicers out there as well.

The main thing I'd say is that you have to expect that at some point, you're going to have to fix something. Good thing is that there are probably loads of videos on Youtube of people with your exact printer showing how to fix things. My recent example was replacing the hot end, mentioned above. I was consistently getting low temperature errors about 4 hours into prints (highly annoying). Research pointed to replacing a thermister (which I had tried and worked for a bit) and then I decided to replace the whole hot end and that's been working. Point is, expect to tinker with it.

Don’t want to add cost? Probably, and as long as the competition doesn’t do much better, why add cost. Which leads me to the next question.
Are most of the US companies using the same designs? Probably.
Don’t want to pay for development? Yep.

Cost, I wager, is a big part. But also their target demographic. I'd guess that most don't care about better dust collection, and the ones that do are getting better machines. My expectation when buying a cheap machine is that it's cheap for a reason, and cutting corners like this is why.

I have a Delta 36-725 from Lowe's. I redid the dust collection on that by chucking the dust shroud around the blade, sealing up the "cabinet", and putting a 4" dust port on the bottom that goes to the DC. Works much better now! I can feel the downdraft from the insert.

I have 3d printed some dust collection shrouds for my bandsaw, but i haven't been able to test them out yet.

 

[Tarhead]

Making changes in dust collection and not measuring the changes in PM2.5 (invisible size range) released into the air is sowing a false sense of safety. It's the dust you can't see that's dangerous, not the stuff you can see. This monitor is inexpensive and closely correlates with expensive lab instruments.
Amazon.com

https://www.aqmd.gov/docs/default-s...monitor-lite---field-evaluation.pdf?sfvrsn=12

 

[tvrgeek]

An interesting watch as this guy alters his tablesaw's dust collection with 3D printed parts. He's in Germany, and using a generic chinese manufactured saw, so the parts aren't applicable to what's available here, but I liked watching the problem solving that he goes through. While it's not perfect, it's a big improvement over the stock dust collection and suits his need as a hobbyist.

With a 3D printer you can do the experiments I can't. I have two ideas. One is to have a ramp in the lower shroud to the side and let the wind of the blade push the dust out of the gullet where the vacuum on the shroud will collect it. My only concern other than it working is any possible harmonic set up.

The other is to focus the airflow across the gullets in and out to force the dust out before it can ride around and out the top. I did really simple testing using my compressor for a focused jet. I just blew the dust sideways and let the cabinet port collect it. It worked, but my 3 HP compressor could not keep up. Anyway, I believe that focused higher drop like from a big shop vac in a loop ( feed the exhaust back as the source across from the vacuum for efficiency) will do a better job on a table saw and band saw. Maintaining the cyclone and HEPA filter in the loop of course. Just pulling from a shroud does little more than picking up from the bottom of the cabinet. The blade is still carrying the dust back up and out.

I have a similar idea for the blade guard but it would be even more in the way than it is now. So just adding a brush on the left side for partial rips is about all I can do.

Unfortunately, my saw is the older design without any lower shroud. It does OK with the big 4 inch SawStop upper blade guard dust collector and somewhat modified cabinet going to a 5 HP ClearView DC. Yea, 5 HP and not enough. Why the tool designers can't hire someone who has at least a sophomore class in fluids to understand airflow I don't know. Sharp edge duct openings, grills across the openings, gad. Any hot-rodder knows better!

It is a popular misconception to "seal" the cabinet. Collection requires AIRFLOW, not static vacuum. Where the airflow is matters. So consider what you are sealing and how that effects the flow. It is like putting holes in your ZCI. When cutting, they are covered anyway. Now a ZCI with a bigger port forward and to the left for partial kerf trims might work very well if enough airflow ducted right to it. A test I intend to try.

 

[mkepke]

@Echd or others
I have SOME basic familiarity with a 3d printer, as I have colleagues that use it at work. What little I do know is all related to that one machine. That would not give me the confidence to buy an open box machine (like I would for a wood working tool).

So for a programming novice like me that might like to explore this for WW jig making, what would you consider the important features to look for or know about? Print size and resolution I understand - what else should I look for?

Picking a decent printer is the easy part. The CAD software (and the skill to use it) is where the massive investment needs to be made. Are you already skilled at CAD?

If not, or you're not prepared to spend the months gaining the skills, you're going to be limited to running already designed parts. That's not necessarily the kiss of death for making wwking jigs as there are quite a few ready-to-print designs out there.

-Mark

 

[Henry W]

Picking a decent printer is the easy part. The CAD software (and the skill to use it) is where the massive investment needs to be made. Are you already skilled at CAD?

If not, or you're not prepared to spend the months gaining the skills, you're going to be limited to running already designed parts. That's not necessarily the kiss of death for making wwking jigs as there are quite a few ready-to-print designs out there.

-Mark

@mkepke - Mark, thanks. That realistic assessment is what I needed to hear.

No I'm NOT experienced or skilled at CAD. I have no real conceptual challenges with 3D thinking, just specific software challenges (how can I ...?).
Your statement of 'spend the months' is what makes me cringe... I guess I'd rather be doing more ww-ing in my free time than CAD learning. Guess I'll continue to watch (here) and learn.

THanks

 

[Wilsoncb]

The other is to focus the airflow across the gullets in and out to force the dust out before it can ride around and out the top. I did really simple testing using my compressor for a focused jet. I just blew the dust sideways and let the cabinet port collect it. It worked, but my 3 HP compressor could not keep up. Anyway, I believe that focused higher drop like from a big shop vac in a loop ( feed the exhaust back as the source across from the vacuum for efficiency) will do a better job on a table saw and band saw. Maintaining the cyclone and HEPA filter in the loop of course. Just pulling from a shroud does little more than picking up from the bottom of the cabinet. The blade is still carrying the dust back up and out.

Good idea, I’m curious where you blew the compressor air, inside the cabinet or outside. Seems like you could dial the air back with a regulator on its feed to reduce the volume required. Or better yet have a cam on the drive shaft to operate a bellow (like a scroll saw).

 

[Echd]

@Echd or others
I have SOME basic familiarity with a 3d printer, as I have colleagues that use it at work. What little I do know is all related to that one machine. That would not give me the confidence to buy an open box machine (like I would for a wood working tool).

So for a programming novice like me that might like to explore this for WW jig making, what would you consider the important features to look for or know about? Print size and resolution I understand - what else should I look for?

Fusion 360 may be daunting at first glance, but it's free, and the bare basics- which are probably all you will need to do jig making and small parts duplication and repair- is quite simple, just hidden behind a small initial learning curve that seems a whole lot worse than it is.

"Tinkercad" is a much less powerful tool (it is a "direct modeling" program rather than a "parametric" program like fusion) but made by the same company, also free, and completely web based. For simple things it can do an admirable job as well.

Honestly I'd buy whatever version of the "ender 3" is newest now. I think it is still the "v3 ke" and "v3 se" with the KE model being slightly technically superior. It will come with the slicing software, and you can learn how to use it with free and ubiquitous models on thingiverse, cults3d, and others. You'll only be in the experiment a couple hundred bucks, and if you have kids or grandkids, I bet they will be excited to learn it... and you might get them started on a highly valuable skillset in drafting and modeling.

The first time you replace some abominable cheaply made but proprietary part on some machine that costs $30 plus $9.99 shipping with $0.03 in plastic, you'll be glad you undertook the journey.

 

[tvrgeek]

Good idea, I’m curious where you blew the compressor air, inside the cabinet or outside. Seems like you could dial the air back with a regulator on its feed to reduce the volume required. Or better yet have a cam on the drive shaft to operate a bellow (like a scroll saw).

I used a pretty strong jet, kluged to the riving knife mount. It would take some experimenting to see how much it could be reduced. Don't think a little puff from a bellows would be near enough. Right idea, it should be part of the design if the saw. Instead of a cam ( too high an RPM) a belt to a turbine blower would be a better design I think. I am going to focus on the band saw first as I use it far more often.

 

[Wilsoncb]

Inspired by the video I thought I would try to improve my TS dust collection. I previous tried a few things, but nothing worked very well because of the blade height adjustment made it difficult to deal with. When I saw how the guy in the video modified the blade plate it made me realize that was the way to go. Here’s some pictures of what I did on my Harvey Alpha 4 hp saw.

This looks a bit flimsy because it sort of is, but I have about a 1” wide pocket. I put this on my zero clearance plate so I wouldn’t have to worry about small pieces getting wedged between the shroud and the blade. The front is pretty stable since I was able to tie the two sides together with the channel shape to beef it up and help capture the sawdust. I couldn’t see a way to safely do that in the back due to the riving knife being in the way. The material I used is 0.09 thick lexan.

The little bit I have run it so far seems to work well though. Previously I was getting a ton of sawdust in the cabinet. As an example, I ran it without the shroud and cut just 2” of 3/4” thick piece and it coated the bottom of the cabinet with sawdust. Typically I have to vacuum out a couple inches every month. After running it with the shroud on, the same 2” cut left nothing. I haven’t run enough to declare success, but it is looking promising. There is definitely less sawdust both inside the cabinet and outside of it.

Picture from inside the cabinet with shroud in place. The bottom half is the factory shroud which has a 3” hose on the bottom that leads to the outside wall of the cabinet.

Below is showing how much room is between the riving knife. Not enough to be able to tie the sides together in the back.