Shop door construction *Update* *new pic*

[Alan in Little Washington]

I'm working on my shop door (34" X 80" X 1 3/8" thick* interior door)- raised panels lower section, divided light upper section, solid oak stiles, rails, and panels. The stiles and rails are cut and profiled. I didn't have a big door bit set, but by removing the slot cutter from a rail bit I was able to use a standard profile cabinet door stile and rail set. Actually, it worked quite well. Just so my panels wouldn't be too thin on the edges, since I need to run a raised panel bit on both sides, I set it up so the groove came out to be 1/2" wide (it is roughly 3/8" deep). I'll trim and profile the panels this morning and make the divided light grid later.

Now my question/problem- the top, middle, and bottom rails are roughly 4 1/2", 6", and 9' wide, but the mating grooves/tenons are only 3/8" long X 1/2" thick (no long tenons). That will not be enough glue surface to hold this heavy, full size, door together.

What is the best way to hold it together?

Options I'm considering:

(1) Glue up the door, drill through the door edges into the rails and use multiple 3/8" or 7/16" X 8" dowels (I'll need to get a long 8" - 10" bit- I can use my big box Father's Day gift certificate

);

(2) Drill, countersink, and install some long lag bolts (could interfere with lockset.)

(3) Use the mortiser to cut 1/2" thick X 4" deep (? limited by chisel length unless I use a Forstner bit and hand chisel) mortises in the stiles, use the tablesaw and tenoning jig to cut matching mortises (actually though-slots) in the ends of the rails (TS blade limits depth to about 3"+ deep), then make up and glue in some 1/2" thick loose tenons to join it all together. I would need to clamp the rails to prevent the ends from splaying since the tenons would be in a slot vs a mortise.

Even though it is more work, I'm leaning towards option # 3 since nothing will be visible on the door edge, unlike #1 and #2, and I think it will be stronger.

What do you guys think? Pics at 11:00.

* thickness is actually 1 11/32- I got a little carried away with the new planer

 

[rick7938]

Re: Shop door construction question *pics*

Alan,

I'm by no means an expert, but if it were me, I would use the lag bolts and plugs. Then to complement that beautiful oak door, I would find a nice antique flush mount lock set like were in my grandmother's old home. They were beautifully scrolled bronze and really looked nice after she polished them for the holidays.

Just a thought.

 

[Joe Scharle]

Re: Shop door construction question *pics*

I like #3
Joe

 

[Travis Porter]

Re: Shop door construction question *pics*

I like number 3 as well.

 

[DaveD]

Re: Shop door construction question *pics*

Although I'm not sure which one I'd do I'll offer a couple of more options.

Screw it together with some really long deck screws. I think I have gotten them at the Borg up to 5" long. McFeeleys has them 7-1/2" long (or maybe longer). I have fixed a couple of doors like this in the past and they seem to be holding after a couple of years. That way you only have to drill the pilot hole real deep. You can easily find smaller diameter drill bits in the 1/8-3/8" range, 12" long at the borgs fairly cheap.You still need the dowel plugs to finish the hole off though.

Before I'd cut the slots on the table saw I'd think about setting up a jig for a plunge router and cutting them blind. I think it would be much stronger.You would have to jig it up real well so the router and/or boards wouldn't have any chance of getting away from you while at the same time let you do a pretty deep plunge in multiple passes.

 

[mshel]

Re: Shop door construction question *pics*

My vote is for the loose tenons. Just my .02

Mike

 

[Alan in Little Washington]

Re: Shop door construction question *pics*

Thanks for the input- seems split between loose tenons and bolts/screws.

Well folks, on this lazy Father's day, this lazy man is going the lazy way- dowels. I used a gift card my kids got me to buy a 12" long 3/8" bit. I will first drill the stiles on the drill press then once the door is glued and clamped, I'll use the long bit to drill into the rails then score or flute the dowels and glue them in.

Other than using a dowel fluting die or scoring the dowel with a saw blade what other ways can I flute a dowel?

 

[Alan in Little Washington]

I got the door glued up and doweled together. It didn't come out half bad. I had to hustle, even using Titebond III, to get everything together before the glued set. I had already drilled the stiles on the drill press in preparation for doweling. Once everything was glued and clamped, I used a big hand drill and 12" long 3/8" bit to extend the dowel holes into the three rails. Driving the dowels caused a bit of a problem. Next time I'll try heating them first. Tomorrow I'll trim the top; do some sanding, though my joints came out pretty decent; work on preparing the top for glass or plexi (whatever is cheapest); make the muntins (sp?) for the divided light look; and start thinking about hardware, hinges, and door jam.

I'll probably finish it with satin wipe on poly since I am not set up to spray yet.

Even though there is a big opening in this door, it is darn heavy already. I may have to consider ball bearing door hinges, though they may be hard to find around here.

Sorry for the lousy pic. I'll take some better ones once the door is finished and hung.

 

[D L Ames]

Great looking door Alan. Is the entire door made up from laminated 4/4 stock?

D L

 

[Alan in Little Washington]

Great looking door Alan. Is the entire door made up from laminated 4/4 stock?

D L

Thanks, Actually its laminated up from 5/4 stock- band milled from oak trees cut down when they cleared my lot to build the house two years ago. The panels and bottom rail are edge and face laminated since I only have an 8" jointer. Everything else is just face laminated to get the 1 3/8" thickness.

 

[Monty]

That is nice looking door - very solid and heavy. Why did you mention heating the dowels -- what does that do?

 

[woodguy1975]

Heating the dowels shrinks them up a bit so they can be inserted easier. :slap:

 

[Alan in Little Washington]

That is nice looking door - very solid and heavy. Why did you mention heating the dowels -- what does that do?

Someone on another forum suggested heating the dowels- says it dries them and makes them shrink slightly. Can't prove it by me. This is the last time I try to dowel from the edge!!!!:BangHead::BangHead::BangHead:

I'll either use short dowels from the mating side or just use mortise and tenon which was my first inclination. Trying to drive an 8" dowel, damp with glue, into a snug 8" hole is darn near impossible. I finally got them in without breaking them by running them on the sander to reduce the diameter.

 

[jeff...]

Great looking door Allen, I really like the knots. Makes it look like real wood which it is.

 

[Alan in Little Washington]

I'm cheap and even though it cost next to nothing per board foot, I try to use as much of my lot harvested oak as possible. I still get a lot of waste. I usually fill the knots with an epoxy/graphite mix so I don't have open knots. It had not been done when the picture was taken, but I filled the knots (and worm holes too) earlier this evening. It works well and usually looks nice.

Great looking door Allen, I really like the knots. Makes it look like real wood which it is.

 

[jeff...]

Nothing at all wrong with "home grown" lumber.

I do the same thing, the stores sell a cheap two part 5 min clear epoxy. I clean the loose stuff out of the kots with an air hose and pop off the epoxy cap and squirt enough in the knots to over fill them a little. Seals em up real nice. Being clear it give the knots some depth effect too. I usally do this during the panel glue up stage. As long as the pannel is semi flat the epoxy will kinda self level it's self. Once the glue up is dry I run the panel through the surface planner and bring it down what eery thickness, usally 3/4". Then sand and finsh as I would a perfect piece of lumber (if there is one)...

Clear Epoxy works great for healing defects, not to mention it puts knots and other defects in their place, permantly. Since all the finishing I do is clear anyways, this seems to work out great for me. Not sure how it would work if you tried to stain the wood though.

I don't like huge nasty looking knots in the furniture I make, but a good small to medium sound knot here and there, adds character andgive it the "real" wood effect, which I truly like.

I should snap a picture of some white oak and show you, it almost looks like birds eye maple, but it's white oak. Only thing I can figure out is a wood pecker went to town on the trunk. And over the corse of years the oak healed it's wounds in some strange and knoty looking way, but it sure is pretty...

To perfect is just that, to perfect. Wood is supposed to be interesting and have character, defect, knots, grain color, tint and hue differences is what makes a piece of furniture pretty to me, thats character...