Manfre's Workshop Build

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kooshball

David
Corporate Member
If I am not mistaken, not too long ago you were trying to figure out the age old "planer vs. jointer vs. neither" question and now you are days away from a free standing shop (with only 5' of set-back) in Cary of all places :icon_thum

All I can say is :notworthy

I'm gonna have you and your wife over for dinner so you can help me sell her on a similar project I have envisioned for my back yard!
 

manfre

New User
Manfre
If I am not mistaken, not too long ago you were trying to figure out the age old "planer vs. jointer vs. neither" question and now you are days away from a free standing shop (with only 5' of set-back) in Cary of all places :icon_thum

All I can say is :notworthy

I'm gonna have you and your wife over for dinner so you can help me sell her on a similar project I have envisioned for my back yard!
You are not mistaken. I tend to do a lot of research and then act quickly. I've been wanting a workshop for longer than I owned this house. I didn't do nearly as much "selling" as the new neighbor and his always outside, loud dogs, but I would be happy to help pitch the idea. ;)

Workshop update

The workshop failed the framing inspection because the builders didn't follow their own engineer stamped plans. I guess this is a potential problem when a company uses sub-contractors. One of the owners is driving out tomorrow to fix things; add the missing collar ties and replace the rafter gussets with larger ones (per the plans). I am less than thrilled with the sub-contractors, but am still happy with the owners. This build is turning out to be speed at the expense of quality and price. I could do a much better job building it myself at a lower cost, but it would have been deferred until at least next spring (bee swarming season) and would have taken me over a month of working a few hours a day whenever I could find them.
 

manfre

New User
Manfre
Collar ties have been added and the gussets have all been replaced with ones of the appropriate size. Luckily for the guy doing the repair work, they also failed to use glue during the initial construction and he had a much easier time removing the gussets.

To pass the final inspection, I need to have all of the untreated wood (only the trim) painted. Fortunately, the panels were primed at the factory, but that still leaves me lots of trim to cover and only a few warm hours on Friday, Saturday and possibly Sunday (if it doesn't rain) to get this done. Friday will be a vacation day caulking like a mad man with as much priming as possible. To help the process along, I'm thinking of using a hair dryer as the temperature starts to fall.

If any of you have spare time on Saturday between 12-4, any help priming the trim would be greatly appreciated. Even 20-30 minutes would make a huge difference and help my race against the cold. If you think you can help out, PM me for the address.
 

DWSmith

New User
David
Now all you need to do is figure out how large the addition needs to be once you get the original shop filled. Funny how they fill up and more space is needed. I went from 500 sq ft to 2500 sq ft and even that is filling up rapidly.

Congratulations on the new space. Looks great.
 

ScottM

Scott
Staff member
Corporate Member
Due to the cold temps I would think you want to be using an exterior oil based primer and not latex. Any painting experts?

Collar ties have been added and the gussets have all been replaced with ones of the appropriate size. Luckily for the guy doing the repair work, they also failed to use glue during the initial construction and he had a much easier time removing the gussets.

To pass the final inspection, I need to have all of the untreated wood (only the trim) painted. Fortunately, the panels were primed at the factory, but that still leaves me lots of trim to cover and only a few warm hours on Friday, Saturday and possibly Sunday (if it doesn't rain) to get this done. Friday will be a vacation day caulking like a mad man with as much priming as possible. To help the process along, I'm thinking of using a hair dryer as the temperature starts to fall.

If any of you have spare time on Saturday between 12-4, any help priming the trim would be greatly appreciated. Even 20-30 minutes would make a huge difference and help my race against the cold. If you think you can help out, PM me for the address.
 

kooshball

David
Corporate Member
It depends on which one you use. Sherwin Williams 'Duration' can be applied as long as you have 2-days that do not drop below 35F.
 

manfre

New User
Manfre
It took about 4 hours, but all of the trim has been caulked. After spending about 90 minutes on the first set of doors, I was starting to regret not splurging for one of the various door upgrades. I'm using fast drying primer and plan on heating the inside of the uninsulated shop. That should ensure that it dries enough before the temperature starts to drop.
 

manfre

New User
Manfre
The rain didn't cooperate and I couldn't prime the trim. Instead, I was able to install the radiant heater and assemble the drill press. I ordered the Jet JDP-17DX drill press, which arrived in a box shrink wrapped to a pallet. The freight delivery driver was awesome. Without even asking or offering a tip, he volunteered to help drag it around my house on the pallet jack and in to the workshop. The shipping weight on this thing is ~250 lbs. We get lined up with the makeshift plywood ramp and the guy says, "we'll need a running start". The running start worked!

Assembly required 2 people because the motor housing weighs well over 100 lbs and needs to slide perfectly on to the column. The assembly was very few steps and took less time than the mobile base.

DSC_5335.JPG

View image in gallery

The radiant heater made the assembly of the drill press a lot more pleasant.

 

manfre

New User
Manfre
A brief update about the shop. Most of the tools are assembled and in the shop. They're currently rolled in to a corner to let me paint most of the floor. My wife's patience with the maze of boxes in the dining room was running thin. Can't blame her and this cold spell didn't have an end in sight.

I'm still trying to figure out a layout for my shop. I do not have the table saw or workbench yet and they are mostly there for size guestimations. To save space, I'll most likely get a router table extension for the saw. The picture is lacking tool storage, but I'm hoping to have most of the tools on the walls or under the 12' workshelf and maybe 1 or 2 rolling cabinets.

The jointer is the Jet 10" jointer/planer combo. The bad reviews were all about manufacturing defects that CS resolved, so I rolled the aggravation dice to save some money and most importantly, space.

Any feedback on the layout below would be a big help. Tools can block the door next to the DC because that one is used less frequently.

workshop-diagram-1.png
 

Bigdog72

New User
Geoff
I work out of a 16 x 24 shop so I can speak with some authority. My thoughts:

1. When working with a medium sized shop, mobility is the key. I have my jointer, planer, sanding center, bandsaw, DC, router table and workbench on casters that move to a common area as required. My drill press, hollow chisel mortiser and miter saw are on one bench (16' long) that is constructed along the back wall.
2. You don't show an outfeed table for your table saw. I have a Unisaw that dominates my space but the 4' wide outfeed doubles as a work bench. I have a workbench on wheels that I can move out when I need to use a vise. There also doesn't appear to be enough space on the infeed side.
3. Storage - plan for it now. Base and wall cabinets will be required to keep all your "stuff". I have 24' of wall cabinets and 20' of base cabinets with over 20 drawers. Plus, I have a wood rack in the shop with most of my wood storage in my garage. (full disclosure:icon_thum)
4. I regret not painting the walls of my shop prior to moving everything in. Too late now :dontknow:
5. Clamps - you will own them and you will need to store them. Make plans for it now.

YMMV!
 

Bill Clemmons

Bill
Corporate Member
Geoff has some excellent points. Here are a couple of additional thoughts.

Think about ripping or crosscutting a sheet of plywood on your tablesaw. First, do you have enough room to left, right, front, and back? Second, what will support it as you begin the cut and what will hold the pieces as you exit the TS? Make the TS, workbench, and counter top behind the saw all the exact same height so they act as auxiliary support for each other. As Geoff said, you need some type of outfeed table to bridge the gap between the TS and workbench. There are numerous plans for a flip up / fold down extension that might work for you.

Under the counter top that runs along the back wall (lathe, miter saw area) I would add as much storage capacity as I could fit under there. A combination of drawers and open shelves works for me.

Do you plan on moving your air compressor around a lot, or leave it in one place and use a hose to reach out into the shop? If you don't plan on moving it a lot, I'd suggest moving it outside, on the other side of that end wall. Build a base platform and cover it so it's out of the weather, then run a line inside w/ a universal fitting. A 25' hose will reach any point in your shop. That frees up just a little more space, and takes a very noisy tool outside. :gar-Bi

What about lumber storage, both long boards and shorts? You'll be amazed at how much space these can take up. I would suggest a wall rack inside to hold maybe 50-75 bf of wood you plan on using in the near future, and some bins for shorts. Then I would plan some type of covered storage outside for additional wood. You never know when you might come across a great deal on some wood, but you'll need a place to store it. Sturdy wall racks on the outside of the shop w/ a simple shed roof will work.

HTH

Bill
 

MarkE

Mark
Corporate Member
What they said. :gar-Bi

But seriously, having everything practical on wheels really helps.

Shop is coming along very nicely.
 

Nate Davey

New User
Nate
One more thought to dog pile on to Bills comments. A vac system, do you have one now or do you plan to get one? If so, to either, plan for the ducting now probably running it through the ceiling. If you move the compressor outside, which I recommend, make enough space for the vac as this is also crazy loud.

I'm not a big fan of drawers as I find they are black holes stuff falls into and disappears, I prefer shelves and lots of them.

A rolling worktable the same height as your table saw comes in hand for and out feed and assembly table.

Great shop and nice tools. Can't wait to see the first project.
 

cptully

New User
Chris
My on question is driven by ideal that get shot down and swept away when space limitations are considered...

I have always preferred to have both the TS and workbench beside it in the middle of the room so I have 4 side access to both.

Chris
 

manfre

New User
Manfre
Thanks for the feedback so far. Really good advice. Every tool, cabinet and table in my shop will be on wheels if it's not screwed to the wall. I'm not sure how much space I will need for most projects, so being able to reconfigure everything will be really helpful.

I had planned on rolling the TS against the workbench to use that as an outfeed, but I really like Bill's idea of a fold away bridge. That would save me from having to constantly move the TS 2' back and forth when I don't need the extra infeed space. With the TS pushed against the workbench, I should have just over 8' from the wall to the blade. With the workbench on wheels, I can shimmy everything towards the DC and open the doors when I need to rip anything longer than 7'. I can rest long pieces on the counter and TS as I line things up and I have roller stands to help support it while feeding.

I have no long term storage space for wood in the shop, except for small blanks. After the outside is painted, I was thinking of adding a ~1' overhang on the back side of the building to give rain protection for stacked boards. Plywood sheets would most likely lay against the wall behind the DC. The side walls are only 7', so it would be a bit of a pain to weave them around the workbench and TS. I don't plan on long term storing of full plywood sheets and have no projects planned that will need more than 1 or 2. [STRIKE]If[/STRIKE] When my wife thinks of a project that will need many sheets, I'll commandeer space in the 12'x12' shed or on the covered porch.:wsmile:

I plan on having a retractable hose reel for the air compressor so I don't end up with a tripping hazard. Eventually, I did intent on moving it outside of where the DC is pictured. That would put it between the workshop and the fence on the far side away from my house.

I haven't thought much about storage for tools and clamps beyond peg board over the counter top and drawers under the workbench. I figured I would mold in as much storage as possible after I have a good idea about where I will use the tools.
 

gator

George
Corporate Member
If you are not going to be moving it to gain more bench space, you might consider recessing the miter saw into the workbench so that the bench acts as support for longer pieces.



If you notice the line on the bench to the left of the saw, I routed out a miter slot to use for a stop block. To hold the stop block, I use the screw-down mechanism from a featherboard from the table saw.

George










 

ZachEakes

New User
Zach
One thing you may want to consider if you ever plan on working with longer lengths of lumber, or doing a lot of rough cutting... is a front porch the same height as your doors threshold so you can put your saw outside.

In the same breath... put in an industrial exhaust fan. If it isn't super cold, have that thing going while you are in the shop. Your lungs will thank you, and your shop won't get as dusty. Plan on your heater, if you aren't using strip heat or infrared... try and get a propane one that can go up in a corner out of the way. Kerosene works well, but in the summer time you want to kick the heater out of the work shop... when winter rolls around you have to find it, dig it out... and you've lost an hour of work time.

I'd also think about some vertical plywood storage built in behind your work bench by the door. Put in some 2x4 runners to keep it off the floor, in case the door ever leaks. You can get much better pricing by buying 10 or 20 count of what you use, than if you buy piecemeal... Just have to have room to store it. You can get a sheet of sanded cabinet grade birch 1/2 inch plywood for 18 bucks... So, skin the inside of your shop with it and store the rest for projects. But you'll need 20 to get that price.

Also think about using your wall space over the benches to store lengths of lumber. A 1 foot overhang isn't enough to keep the weather off it. If its on the North side it'll stay damp, if it is on the south side it'll warp and twist... Unless you want to box in the area under the eaves to keep blowing rain off it, you'll need to stick every layer and plane it all before you use it as it'll weather outside.

2x4's about 2 feet long cocked up just a bit screwed to the studs works quite well. If your head isn't occupying that space, you can use it for storage... Put a layer of cheap stuff down first to keep everything else straight. Your rafters work well too, box in between 3 rafters and take a piece out of the middle one so you have an access hatch to get up there. Put plywood on both sides of the rafters in that area... otherwise you'll have to lift your board straight up between the rafters and then spin it 90 degrees for it to stay.

Think about some serious lighting. Depending if your height is 7 feet to the rafters or 8 feet, think about the slim line T12 bulbs and a lot of them. I would put in 3 rows, one in the middle... one half way to the door side, and the third directly above the work bench. Your work is only as accurate as you can see the marks....

Work bench wise... Make every top out of double thick 1/2 inch or 3/4 so you can use screws right into the top to make jigs and fixtures. Clamps suck when you can zip in a few screws and keep right on working. A layer of plastic sheeting (2-3 mil) will keep any glue from sticking your work to the bench, even epoxy... Zip in screws and you can run your router around... set the depth on the side of the piece you are working on... and it won't mar up the surface very much. I like to epoxy coat the tops of the benches and make them out of pretty decent plywood so it is easy to loft lines and such right on the top... But OSB board works great too. Use short screws for the top layer so you can pull it up and throw down another sheet...

Block in solid a section for your vice, and to bolt down a bench grinder to sharpen your tools... A bench grinder that walks is no good for the edge of your chisel... And a vice that isn't locked down is a fancy anvil...

Think about a 3 foot deep bench at the back wall like you have drawn, and a 2 foot wide bench going the entire length of the back wall. The 2 foot bench would be mounted at the same height as the table saw and other tools. Keep this one absolutely clean, otherwise you'll need a shovel every time you want to turn on the saw. I build a rectangle out of 2x4's however long, skin the top and then line up each end with a stud. Run a diagonal and screw it to the stud, and the frame of the top. 3 screws per upright. Now your table doesn't have legs so you can store stuff under it that is big... and if it needs to come out for a bigger project, you can kick it to the curb in 30 minutes. See if your drill press will get down to the height of your table saw, so you can dowel, or make plugs, and put it in the corner toward the end. Leave it far enough out of the corner that you can pull it out a foot or two and be at the doorway. (2 or 3 feet from the corner...)

Think about if you are going to use a chop saw, and make a drop down in the 2 foot table that can be easily taken out for its use... Use the table on the drill press as your outfeed side.

I like the 3 foot work bench to be 40-42 inches finished in height so you can work all day and not hurt your back from stooping. I'm 6'1... and that is the right height for anything laid flat on the bench. If I need to do something taller, I drag over a pallet... The 3 foot work bench means you can store things on the top of the bench at the back. I would make one corner a cabinet floor to ceiling. The top section being just for home made jigs and fixtures that otherwise pile up and destroyed when their use is forgotten. Put in cabinets above your head height the whole way across the top of the bench, and hang some serious lights under them. If you paint nothing else, paint this alcove white...

(Number the jigs, and have a note book that never leaves that shelf with what they are used for... and what model number door hinge that router jig is meant for...)

My favorite style work bench is a 5 foot by 9 foot table, with storage for full sheets of plywood on shelves inside it... and boards 10 to 11 feet long. If your saw has a motor hung out the back, you'll need a drop in spacer between it and the table, thats where you get the 10-11 feet. 4x4 posts with no uprights in between them. Make a frame on the inside at floor height and put 3/4 plywood there, put in 2 shelves, one real close to the top for 1/8th and 1/4 inch plywood with fine veneers. 2x6's to frame in the table top so it stays flat. Rip or joint one edge true. Use this with the 3 foot bench, and don't make the 2 footer down the side... Build a cart for your table saw to ride in, and bring the height of this bench up to 38 to 40 inches.

With that bench you have 3 1/2 to 4 feet on both sides in your 12 foot width, which is plenty to walk around if you are working solo.

That bench means one man can rip or cross cut a full sheet of plywood. Put the bench offset to one side of the shop, so your fence extension on the saw hangs towards the wall... you can pull your boards and plywood out from any side.

Also, don't get a router table. Get a table saw wing that works like one. Bench Dog makes them. Get a 2 1/4 horsepower router, and an aluminum drop in plate and you'll be able to do stuff on the verge of a shaper.

Power wise... Put in a plug every 4 feet, and run 240 volt power out there. Pull wire under the shop and bring it up to your middle work bench... for your saws and stuff so you aren't tripping over extension cords.

Air compressor wise... You'll hate the spiral cord for most things. Get a good year hose from harbor freight when they go on sale. A 25 footer, and one long enough to get out to the driveway to air up your tires.

Cheers,

Zach
 
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