Ripping slats on a table saw

[Claus]

I keep flip-flopping between both of these methods and want some opinions which is better/safer.

FIRST -

Keep moving the board to the fence for each cut, obviously use push stick to get the slat past the blade. I know that it’s better for the off cut not to be between the blade and the fence but this setup doesn’t move the fence and the cuts are consistent.

or SECOND -

Position the guide for the desired thickness and move the board and fence for each subsequent cut.

Thanks for any comments and advice

—Claus

 

[Mike Davis]

For years I did your first method. Now I use the second. As long as you are careful setting the fence I think it can be just as consistent and certainly much safer.

 

[drw]

I am not sure which is the preferred approach, but I use the first method. I use Jessem Stock Guides to hold the stock against the fence and prevent kick-back. All of this works well except for really thin cuts, then the second method is very useful.

 

[mquan01]

1st method with a gripper spanning both pieces to push both through the blade

 

[Echd]

I am not sure which is the preferred approach, but I use the first method. I use Jessem Stock Guides to hold the stock against the fence and prevent kick-back. All of this works well except for really thin cuts, then the second method is very useful.

Agree with this, and I also use the Jessem stock guides.

 

[Wilsoncb]

I believe the first method can be more dangerous. The picture you posted is right on the edge and can be done safely using methods others have posted.
However, if you start to cut any closer the fence there are at least a couple issues that depend on the thickness (or height) of the material, as well as the length.
1. Most obvious, thicker (and/or harder) material to the point of challenging the combination of blade sharpness and motor strength. Not good.
2. Blade insert opening relationship to fence. Extreme case, insert opening, open to fence. Again this is somewhat dependent on material stiffness, strength and tendency to curve as stresses are relieved while cutting. Material may want to go into the insert opening and quickly get wedged. It can also tip into the blade. Imagine using a gripper spanning both sides of the blade. Material between the blade and fence tilts, your gripper goes right into the blade.

 

[Gofor]

Have done the first many times, but second method is IMHO safer. With the first method, I usually put a featherboard on the fence to prevent the material from lifting. (That is using a push stick. Doesn't work well with a Gripper). I also use zero clearance inserts most of the time,

For thin slats, #2 is definitely better.

Reality is I would probably use #1 for just a couple due to ease and speed of set-up. For more than that I would go with #2.

Nice stop block gauge! Simple but effective.

 

[Bill_L]

How long are your slats? I have a jig that works well for ~20" slats or shorter. You can get consistent widths pretty easily with the jig. The back overhangs and holds helps push the piece through. And the top piece holds the slat down. Hope that all makes sense.

 

[Willemjm]

First method always, reasons below:

1.) Table saw measuring tape is accurate, means accurate cut to dimension, without having to adjust the fence with each cut.

2.) My fence has a slight toe out setting, so the kerf is a little more than the blade dimension. That prevents kick back and allows kiln dried wood not to close on the blade during the cut. It also means I get a jointer quality cut on the fence side, but not necessarily on the piece left of the blade.

3.) With kiln dried wood, a lot of stress can be relieved during the cut. When that happens the cut piece on the non fence side, is never true and perfectly straight. Especially on long pieces. If a riving knife is used, the stress can be challenging to keep the piece 100% against the fence along the total cut length, meaning we end up with a cut which is not 100% true, both sides. I don’t us a riving knife.

We do a bunch of rails and stiles for face frames and cabinet doors. We use rough sawn kiln dried Soft Maple. To be 100% accurate, most of the work goes into milling the pieces to exact dimensions, thickness and width and have them perfectly true and straight. The cope and stick as well as joinery is fast in comparison.

This is our procedure:
Joint one edge of the rough sawn board.

With the jointed edge against the fence, using first method, all the pieces are ripped, 3/16” wider than final dimension. Due to stress in the lumber the cut pieces are never 100% true.

Back to the jointer and joint one face until the jointed face is 100% flat.

To the planer and plane with the rough face being planed to 3/4” dimension.

Back to the jointer and joint one edge, giving a true 90 degree angle and a straight edge. The piece now has three accurate sides.

Back to the table saw and rip the non true edge to final dimension with a quality rip blade leaving no tooth marks. The cut normally removes less than 1/8”.

Those pieces are now all at perfectly accurate dimensions, flat and true. Ready to go to the miter saw for length cuts and the shapers for cope and stick.

The large cabinet companies have a machine which does all of that in one pass through a multiple process. The machine has optics, which allows elimination of lumber defects and maximizing yield based on a bill of quantities.

 

[Dreuxgrad]

Got a planer? Experience? Priorities, safety or accuracy?
I've used both, with my preference being the first (fence) with a zero clearance.

 

[Mike Davis]

I usually cut pieces for laminating. They can be as thin as 1/16”, as wide as 2 1/2”, and as long as 9’. I never had much success with these extremes against the fence.

Using a stop to set the width and keeping the bulk of the board against the fence made all the difference.

Cutting 1.5 inch widths or even 3/4” is completely different.

 

[HMH]

I personally go w/ method 1 for rips where the “keeper piece” between the blade and fence is say ~3/4” or wider, (using a gripper catching both sides for anything between day 3/4 and 1.1/2” or so, and Jessem stock guides for anything wider, (the stock guides get in the way of a push stick for me for anything narrower).

I go w/ method 2 for super-thin rips, (1/8-1/2 or so, as I generally only need 1 or 2 rips of anything that narrow, but if I needed to batch out lots, would probably come up w/ a way to go w/ option 1 for the reasons Willem described.

 

[bainin]

Typically I use #1 but TBH it doesnt feel very safe. I've employed a Gripper, push sticks, featherboards, fence mounted guides...but just moving wood thru that little gap
between blade and fence always feels a little uncontrolled to me.

b

 

[Dee2]

I've not done a lot of this but when I do, I use #, shorten the fence, and use a push stick. But then, I can change how far the fence extends over the table. Probably could replicate that with a board clamped to the fence. YMMV

 

[Wilsoncb]

This is our procedure:
Joint one edge of the rough sawn board.

With the jointed edge against the fence, using first method, all the pieces are ripped, 3/16” wider than final dimension. Due to stress in the lumber the cut pieces are never 100% true.
Question: So if the final dimension is 1/8”, you rip to 5/16”?

Back to the jointer and joint one face until the jointed face is 100% flat.
Question: are you jointing on the edge you just ripped in the above step, or 90 degrees to that face?

To the planer and plane with the rough face being planed to 3/4” dimension.
Question: where did the 3/4” dimension come from?

Back to the jointer and joint one edge, giving a true 90 degree angle and a straight edge. The piece now has three accurate sides.
Question: again I am lost on which edge is being jointed, perhaps you could explain with starting rough dimensions and desired final dimensions targeted? Then reference sides being worked off initial cut?

Back to the table saw and rip the non true edge to final dimension with a quality rip blade leaving no tooth marks. The cut normally removes less than 1/8”.

Those pieces are now all at perfectly accurate dimensions, flat and true. Ready to go to the miter saw for length cuts and the shapers for cope and stick.

The large cabinet companies have a machine which does all of that in one pass through a multiple process. The machine has optics, which allows elimination of lumber defects and maximizing yield based on a bill of quantities.

Sorry to be a pain I’m just not following your explanation. See above for questions.

 

[Willemjm]

Sorry to be a pain I’m just not following your explanation. See above for questions.

Question: So if the final dimension is 1/8”, you rip to 5/16”?

Face frames would be the least width, typically 1 1/2” wide. I rip to 1 11/16” wide.

Question: are you jointing on the edge you just ripped in the above step, or 90 degrees to that face?

We ripped along the edge, so we have both faces still as rough lumber. We joint one of those faces, 90 degrees to the edge we ripped.

Question: where did the 3/4” dimension come from?

The rough lumber comes in 4/4. That measures around 1” thick. After jointing the one face flat and true, the thickness will now be around 7/8” or less. The jointed face which is perfectly flat is used as a reference in the planer. One or two passes through the planer then mills the the opposite rough face, leaving the lumber at 3/4” thick X 1 11/16” wide.

Question: again I am lost on which edge is being jointed, perhaps you could explain with starting rough dimensions and desired final dimensions targeted? Then reference sides being worked off initial cut?

Does not matter which edge. Because this started off as rough lumber, which may have been cupped, neither of the 3/4” edges will be perfectly at 90 degrees to the 1 11/16” face. I joint one edge and mark a pencil cross on the opposite edge, so I know that is the remaining edge needing milling. The piece will now be closer to 1 1/2” wide, depending on how much stress was in the lumber. Could be anywhere between 1 5/8” to 1 9/16” wide.

The final rip cut to exactly 1 1/2” wide leaves the piece perfectly flat, straight and with exact 90 degree edges.

When everything is true and flat, the face frames and door stiles and rails end up 100% square when assembled. No need to even check for that. If we are 1/64th out on a tall door with our milling, after assembly, the door will end up as not square or not flat.

 

[Wilsoncb]

Question: So if the final dimension is 1/8”, you rip to 5/16”?

Face frames would be the least width, typically 1 1/2” wide. I rip to 1 11/16” wide.

Question: are you jointing on the edge you just ripped in the above step, or 90 degrees to that face?

We ripped along the edge, so we have both faces still as rough lumber. We joint one of those faces, 90 degrees to the edge we ripped.

Question: where did the 3/4” dimension come from?

The rough lumber comes in 4/4. That measures around 1” thick. After jointing the one face flat and true, the thickness will now be around 7/8” or less. The jointed face which is perfectly flat is used as a reference in the planer. One or two passes through the planer then mills the the opposite rough face, leaving the lumber at 3/4” thick X 1 11/16” wide.

Question: again I am lost on which edge is being jointed, perhaps you could explain with starting rough dimensions and desired final dimensions targeted? Then reference sides being worked off initial cut?

Does not matter which edge. Because this started off as rough lumber, which may have been cupped, neither of the 3/4” edges will be perfectly at 90 degrees to the 1 11/16” face. I joint one edge and mark a pencil cross on the opposite edge, so I know that is the remaining edge needing milling. The piece will now be closer to 1 1/2” wide, depending on how much stress was in the lumber. Could be anywhere between 1 5/8” to 1 9/16” wide.

The final rip cut to exactly 1 1/2” wide leaves the piece perfectly flat, straight and with exact 90 degree edges.

OK, we are talking about 2 different things. I assumed we were talking about a very narrow slat, like 1/4" or less. I wouldn't even consider option #2 for anything more than 1/2" wide.

 

[Willemjm]

OK, we are talking about 2 different things. I assumed we were talking about a very narrow slat, like 1/4" or less. I wouldn't even consider option #2 for anything more than 1/2" wide.

I normally have enough scrap lying around in the shop to cut 1/4" strips or thinner. Those offcuts are normally too small to handle on the table saw safely. Typically I would use that to edge plywood, as I don't like edge-banding and prefer a 1/4" strip glued and 23 gauge pin nailed, with a bit of touch up.

I normally cut those on the bandsaw and then run them through my drum sander.

 

[Howie]

I keep flip-flopping between both of these methods and want some opinions which is better/safer.

FIRST -
View attachment 220813

Keep moving the board to the fence for each cut, obviously use push stick to get the slat past the blade. I know that it’s better for the off cut not to be between the blade and the fence but this setup doesn’t move the fence and the cuts are consistent.

or SECOND -
View attachment 220814

Position the guide for the desired thickness and move the board and fence for each subsequent cut.

Thanks for any comments and advice

—Claus

1st

 

[Rwe2156]

It's really a matter of what you're comfortable with. Always go with the safest method for you. I think pushing 3/4 - 1" wide strips should be within most people's comfort zone.

Regardless which way you go, you need to replace that insert with a zero clearance.

You don't say how wide the strips are, but if its for bent laminations, I'll assume its 3/32 - 1/8". Personally, I have no reservations about ripping strips against the fence down to 3/32", but I've been doing this almost 40 years and I'm not worried about final dimension b/c I use a drum sander.

I use a DIY wood push shoe that engages the strip + the off cut. Important the blade doesn't protrude too much above the wood as it is cutting into the sole of the shoe. Good pressure against the fence. Re-joint the edge as needed.

For strips wider than 1 1/2" I use the bandsaw. Joint an edge/resaw/joint an edge, etc. Then I run all the strips through a drum sander, rough side up.

I've done bent laminations this way up to 8" wide.