Exterior built-up newel posts

[HMH]

Hey folks,

I'm finally getting around to a few outdoor projects, and 1st up is a new set of front stairs. Our front entrance is pretty massive, w/ an 8' wide stair climbing 6' or so to a covered porch. The original homeowners had a very basic set of stairs, (stringers and treads only, no risers), framed straight to the front yard, (no front walk). I demo'd the existing stair over the weekend, and my concrete guy poured the new 60' walkway this afternoon, so I'm in business.

I know the virtues of composite decking, but honestly I've never warmed up to it. W/ that said, The new stairs will be built out of PT (KDAT) pine, painted to match the rest of the porch. I'm already planning to back-prime all sides of the framing prior to installation for a little added longevity.

the stairs themselves are straight forward enough, but my real question is w/ the newel posts. Has anyone built a set they could share some tips and tricks on? My first thought is to build a series a face frames in the shop, and then simply slide them over a typical 4x4. I assume I'll be using primarily 1" stock for the face frames, and can glue and pin them together in the shop, then putty and prime the finished assembly in the field. Is there anything thinner than 1" stock when dealing w/ PT wood? Should I consider another species instead?

I would welcome any thoughts or advise on materials or joinery measures to ensure the joints stay nice and tight over time.

Thanks folks - looking forward to the feedback!

 

[gritz]

From my perspective, (30 yrs. as a contractor,) you have set yourself up for disappointment and repetitive maintenance when you mention paint, treated wood and tight joints. You didn't mention the style of the home, but given your stated parameters, and the weather exposure, I would look at the new composites for all but the framing and deck boards.

 

[Phil S]

I would use Fypon, which comes in all stock sizes and panels. It machines well and glues together very well with PL Premium. It you really want wood, consider cyprus

 

[chris_goris]

From my perspective, (30 yrs. as a contractor,) you have set yourself up for disappointment and repetitive maintenance when you mention paint, treated wood and tight joints. You didn't mention the style of the home, but given your stated parameters, and the weather exposure, I would look at the new composites for all but the framing and deck boards.

Heath,
I agree with Robert. All that work will look terrible after a year or 2 no matter what wood and adhesives you use. I would look into AZEK materials. They are used in some of the harshest environments on the planet and they hold up. No, its not cheap, but what worth having is?. Just my $.02.

 

[BWSmith]

Just simply as a data point because I loathe composites.......and everything that goes with it.

We just ran a set of original wood,exterior shutters through our spraybooth.They are 1964,and still going strong.Two coats of "enhanced" oil based paint and they're going to be good for about 10 years or so before needing to be "shot" again.

There are ways to accomplish what you want to do.....it's just that once the "C" word(composites)has been introduced,I believe it's all downhill from there.Good luck,dig around some historic building,preservation efforts(no composites allowed),and another place is how we run them in St. Parks.

 

[Jeff]

+1 to Cypress or KDAT.

http://www.capitolcitylumber.com/lumber-plywood/yp-treated-lumber-decking

but my real question is w/ the newel posts.

Maybe this will help in your design (section B). I may be confused and naive here but it seems that a 5" square newel post is about the minimum with standard dimensioned lumber.

http://www.gifford-park-assoc.org/images/stories/pdfs/porchguidelines3_9_14

Ok, so you're not warm to composite porch decking construction. What are your expectations for painting maintenance and repair when needed to keep it looking nice? It'll take more of a beating than your covered porch so maybe composites are appropriate for this segment. ???

http://www.vintagewoodworks.com/azek-post-sleeves.html

 

[chris_goris]

Just simply as a data point because I loathe composites.......and everything that goes with it.

We just ran a set of original wood,exterior shutters through our spraybooth.They are 1964,and still going strong.Two coats of "enhanced" oil based paint and they're going to be good for about 10 years or so before needing to be "shot" again.

There are ways to accomplish what you want to do.....it's just that once the "C" word(composites)has been introduced,I believe it's all downhill from there.Good luck,dig around some historic building,preservation efforts(no composites allowed),and another place is how we run them in St. Parks.

The older I get the less I personally like making things beautiful and refinishing them 10 years later (if that long). The truth is,wood moves. Wood dries out during hot dry periods and then sucks up moisture when its damp out. None of this lends it to being painted. I love wood, I truly do, I have dedicated countless hours to learning about it, studying it and working it. But I also believe it has a place. Sure, it has been successfully used in dry applications for centuries outdoors, but eventually , it rots. This is where I have no issues with using new producs like AZEK. The inherent satisfaction I derive from building things from wood is the finished form, especially architectural details. All of those details can be replicated using AZEK and I do not have to worry about, splitting, checking, rotting, swelling or bug infestations. It just keeps on looking like the day it was completed and I can look back at it and smile instead of thinking... geeez that looked great once.

 

[HMH]

Awesome - thanks very much for the feedback guys. Jeff especially - thanks very much for the links, that is exactly what I was looking at for reference material.

As a backstory, the house is relatively new, (built in '06). We bought it roughly 14 months ago after stumbling across it at an unbeatable deal, while looking for land in the area to build on. The original owner's were somewhat "eccentric" in their tastes, so the majority of this first year has been on the interior, but that is just about buttoned up. (I WILL re-build the kitchen cabinets before I die, but that's a project for down the road).

Re, the porch, my inclination for sticking w/ PT was primarily to match the rest of the roughly 60'x10' wrap around front porch which is in great shape being covered and somewhat protected from direct sun by a generous overhang, (the decking was never stained, but still looks great - it will however be protected in stereo w/ the new stair project).

You all raise good points however, that the stair will take a beating from the elements - the now demo'd stair showed a hard life. I'll definitely look into the Fypon you suggested Phil, (PM inbound), and willsourch some Cypress as well to weigh pros/cons.

Thanks again guys, keep 'em coming!

 

[HMH]

After a bit more reading, I'm contemplating going w/ standard KDAT Pine for the stringers,treads, balusters and rails, and then using Miratec for the built-up newels, risers, and potentially stringer fascia. Any words of caution here?

After a bit of research, I like the Fypon, Azek, etc. systems, but as the trim will be painted to match the rest of the house, these (pre-finished) products seem like a bit of a waste? The Miratec comes pre-primed, but would still need paint. I haven't heard anything bad about it, but would certainly welcome any real-world experience.

Butt jointed corners, (I try to avoid miters on exterior projects), w/ biscuit, glue, and pins? I understand that Miratec can take a recessed nail head unlike the older Masonite?

Thanks!

 

[golfdad]

Who sells Fypon ?

 

[Phil S]

ProBuild - Raleigh

Who sells Fypon ?

 

[JackLeg]

There are 75 year old homes in Louisiana with unpainted cypress siding. Just sayin'!

 

[Skymaster]

cypress NICE NICE similar to cedar in hardness, grain similar to syp. Sooooooooooooooooo nice to work

 

[zdorsch]

Heath,

How big will the newels be? Will the panels directly on top of the 6x6 or spaced out? I ask because you may want to vent between the panel and the post if you can or even wrap the post will peel and stick membrane. This will prevent moisture from the post being driven "out" through the panels. I'm not sure if this would be a problem with miratec as I've never used it, but I have paint failure from moisture issues with a post that I wrapped a few years ago for my mailbox (although I used all pressure treated).

Zach