YATST - yet another tiny shop post

[CarvedTones]

My wife and I are going to redo my shop area as a joint project. She is much better at organizing things and I think she is also going to keep me from cutting too many corners (my low budget is largely self inflicted).

I have about half of one bay where I basically have about 8'x8' that will always be shop space and where I will most often work. In the other bay, I have about 6' along the wall in front of the car and I can back the car out to use the whole bay when I need to. Right now, the big BS, the TS, shop vac and Thien separator are there. There are cabinets on the wall above the TS and shop vac where I keep shop related stuff. I also have one tall cabinet elsewhere on that wall.

There are two things we have pretty much decided on.

One is a pegboard cabinet, where you have a big door (to the cabinet) with pegboard front and back, another just like it on a second hinge and then pegboard on the back.

The other is a workbench against the wall with rollout cabinets or tool stations beneath it.

I currently have a benchtop TS mounted on a good tool stand and a 14" BS with riser as my only stationary tools (though I rarely move my benchtop DP). I have a CMS, but it isn't mounted; I pull it out, use it and put it back when done. I have a bunch of handheld stuff - circular saw, jigsaw, router, drills, angle grinder, rotary tools, etc. I have a little 9" BS I use sometimes, a grinder and a lightweight scroll saw. I will be building a small carving bench and I want carving tools easily accessible.

Anyway, I am looking for advice like "I wish I had (or had not)..." or "You might want to consider...". I am actually prying the wallet open for once.

 

[Douglas Robinson]

Andy:

A few pics would help make it easier to give some advice. How much height do you have?

Doug

 

[ScottM]

Andy, I have the WOOD issue with plans for that peg board cabinet. IMHO whatever cabinet you use hang it with a french cleats.

 

[CarvedTones]

I have the plans also; I have the Small Shop supplement.

I have a fair amount of height but an I-Beam bisects it. I do have a small lumber rack up there now.

Yah, pictures would help. Right now we are set up for a garage sale; maybe over the weekend I will snap some pics.

EDIT - I do have a couple of shots; I forgot I posted these a while back.

The half bay:



The wall in front of the other bay:



The little fridge is moved elsewhere and my Thien separator is there now.

 

[froglips]

As a fellow small shopper, a few thoughts jump out.

Tell us more about this I-beam. Is it steel or wood?

Height might be key. Very high shelves for the less often used tools. Some folks have rigged up pulleys to help with that.

You didn't mention electric outlets. While this is underway, do you have plenty of extra outlets? Enough circuits? Lights seperate from tool circuits? My rule of thumb is an extention cord means I need more outlets Its also an uncelebrated perk of the small shop!

If you are planning to do lots of carving, this might also be a good time to focus on lighting. Natural as much as feasible, top flight flourscent otherwise.

I've said before, and odds are good again. Make a map. I call it my "shop play action figure playset". Done to scale, its an amazing tool to help see how things can flow. I use a scale of a 4x8 sheet of plywood as the guage.

Imagine my surprise when I realized an 8 foot long piece of wood needed more than 8 feet to pass over my table saw

Oh, and don't forget to buy more tools!!!

Jim

 

[CarvedTones]

Interestingly enough, I just went over the outlets in the "heater" thread. I have a 20 in the 8x8 area that is dedicated (no other outlet or lights on it). I have a 15 that is dedicate to the openers, but using outlets, so I ran cords (I know; you hate them, but I am okay with them if they are not on the floor). The I Beam is steel.

To handle sheet goods, I will back the car out and have a bay and a half to roll stuff out into. I am most concerned about making stowing things away and pulling them out fairly easily.

Lights I got - an Ott, a Day-Lite, a fluorescent and several incandescents.

 

[medic]

know what you are going threw, I went from a 140 to a 320 sq ft shop. some things to consider, extension cords ARE trip hazards you can never have enough wall recepticals mine are every six feet @ 50 inches high so when I lean a sheet of ply I can still get to a receptical. also look into overhead storage if possible. rolling work / storage cabinets If you can put the nice things in when you first start then you will be alot happier in the long run so plan it, how it will fit in , if it will fit in to YOUR idea of how you want your space to be ,then go for it. you are the one who will be working it .

 

[CarvedTones]

Read my reply to this - I don't recommend the drawer units after receiving them...

One thing we have come up with is that I need a bunch of shallow drawers for carving and other hand tools. This frees up the large drawers to hold (gasp ) large things. Whodathunkit?

I ordered two of these:
http://www.homestorageconcepts.com/...crapbook Storage - 5 Drawer - Wood Finish.htm
That place currently has the best price; I found more info and better pictures elsewhere. I wanted a map chest (just missed one at the thrift store) but didn't want to pay hundreds of dollars. These drawers are sturdy enough (paper is heavy). In a little over 2 cu ft, I will have over 10 sq ft of surface area. This will free up quite a bit of space in deep drawers or on shelves. I am using drawers and shelves in a horribly inefficient manner right now, especially the deep and/or tall shelves. I have way too much airspace in my cabinets.

I only have one very short extension cord on the floor to a freestanding bench. The cord is the heavy duty flat kind and I have it in one of those rubber casings that lets stuff roll over it.

Oddly enough, I am adding a small bench - a carving bench on a pedestal (bar table base). It takes up very little space because I can place it near a cabinet without blocking the door. When I mallet carve, I tend to shake stuff off the bench, so nothing could spend much time on the benchtop, even if there was room. I am not talking about using the main bench for general storage; I mean other tools, plans, pencils, etc, that are part of what I am working on.

Tossing stuff is a big part of this also.

 

[Travis Porter]

Drawers over doors. In cabinets with doors I tend to pile junk and lose it. Drawers are easy to get stuff in and out.

I like drawers to be between 4 and 5 inches deep. Any shallower and you can't change their use very easily.

Set up a way to have a metal vise. Not permanently mounted, but that you can put on and remove pretty easily.

On wall mount cabs, I like the doors to have a rim now so you can hang stuff on the inside.

Shelves over top of your garage doors are nice for stuff that isn't used much. Don't know how high or how much space you have there, but for me it was available space and cheap to get accomplished.

 

[CarvedTones]

Yeah, I am changing philosophy on cabinets; large items like hand held power tools need to occupy the deep shelves. Paint and glue needs shallow shelves or even drawers. I am not as big of a fan of large drawers for most stuff though. I use a lot of hand tools (knives, gouges, chisels, files, etc) that don't need much height and should not be piled up. I don't foresee that changing, so dedicating the new shallow drawers to them makes sense for me.

The kind of stuff that really eats space are things like a fairly standard socket set toolbox. It's maybe 3" tall but sits a shelf that could hold something a foot tall. That's just one example.

I used to have a shelf over one garage door, but I took it down when I was insulating and putting pegboard up (even though it is useless there, I went with pegboard all around) a few years ago and never put it back. I have another high shelf against the back wall filled with some stuff that gets used and some that has not moved in years. I may take some of that. It is more convenient as I keep the ladder right there and it doesn't matter whether the door is up or down or the car is in or not.

I have a metal vise that is "permanently" attached to a low bench for straddling and pounding. That bench is on the "must go" list but I will figure out a way to attach the vise quickly. Probably mount it to a board that can be clamped to the bench.

 

[JimD]

I have a dedicated shop of about 400 square feet and still am out of space. I used to use a garage I shared with cars. Dedicated space is nice but you can get work done in your arrangement.

I use my B&D workmate a surprising amount and I have a sperate assembly table/outfeed table/workbench. It folds up pretty small. I made a lattice work piece of 1x4s with the dados cut tight so I could assemble with glue and no fasteners. It is 3 foot by 8 foot but 3 foot or even 2 foot by 6 foot would be adequate. I use it to cut up sheet goods. I have the rip capacity and infeed and outfeed support but I still think it is easier to rip to near final size with a circular saw and shoot board and then go to the table saw.

If you can squeeze in a long base cabinet along a wall it is very nice to have a long fence for stops and have a semi-permanent setup for your CMS. It helps accuracy a lot to measure for a stop instead of putting a mark on the wood and trying to cut to the mark.

Jim

 

[Gofor]

Andy: I don't know if this will help, but as you are looking for ideas, I made these cab's relatively cheap out of MDO ply I got at Builder's Discount, pine construction lumber, and pine ply. They are 18" deep inside which allows for almost all cased tools, and are hung by the French Cleat method, so they can be moved laterally to allow for taller items like BS, DP, or on-end lumber storage. They are hung high enough that I can get the nose or tail gate of my 2500 truck under them when necessary. Shelves are adjustable.

Wall cleat


Hanging together


As now installed


Just for ideas' sake

Go

 

[Travis Porter]

That was a good idea on leaving the space between the cabs to allow for the bandsaw and drill press. Took me a minute to figure it out.

 

[CarvedTones]

Besides the space savings, I like that orientation of the BS also. I may have to modify my cheesy shop made base to do that. In the second picture of my shop area, the hand truck in front of the BS actually slips under the base as I have small wood rails on the edges of the base. Sometimes I want to do a quick cut of something small without moving it out and invariably something will fall behind it and it is likely a little safer and more accurate to stand to the side of the table.

BTW, the cab in a box in that picture has been assembled and lives over the garage sink now.

 

[CarvedTones]

Jim,

No surprise at all about the workmate. I have an off brand one and I have often thought of getting a second one. I don't use my CMS often enough to mount it. It's hanging on the wall in the second picture up above. The BS is the only stationary tool that sees a lot of use.

 

[CarvedTones]

In case anyone took this as a recommendation, after receieving them I am disappointed!

They are very poorly constructed and arrived in bad shape:

http://s43.photobucket.com/albums/e396/arbarnhart/drawers/?albumview=slideshow

I think they will actually be usable, but not worth the money. On the plus side, when I complained they filed a claim with UPS saying that was all shipping damage and said they would send new ones. I don't think it was shipping damage and told them so (boxes are fine) but they filed anyway. I was to hold on to the boxes and products in the condition they arrived for 5 business days, which ended yesterday, so that UPS could photograph them and/or pick them up. After the 5 days, I am free to throw them away or do what I want with them. UPS never contacted me. I repaired them last night. There were broken dowels that I had to replace (the tiniest ones I have ever seen; I made replacements from pieces of a small wooden skewer) and there are a couple of surface defects that I really can't fix properly, but glued the chips down so they won't get worse. So I am feeling no guilt about this; I may end up with an extra set, but it involved a lot of effort on my part and they are anything but new and perfect.

One thing we have come up with is that I need a bunch of shallow drawers for carving and other hand tools. This frees up the large drawers to hold (gasp ) large things. Whodathunkit?

I ordered two of these:
http://www.homestorageconcepts.com/...crapbook Storage - 5 Drawer - Wood Finish.htm
That place currently has the best price; I found more info and better pictures elsewhere. I wanted a map chest (just missed one at the thrift store) but didn't want to pay hundreds of dollars. These drawers are sturdy enough (paper is heavy). In a little over 2 cu ft, I will have over 10 sq ft of surface area. This will free up quite a bit of space in deep drawers or on shelves. I am using drawers and shelves in a horribly inefficient manner right now, especially the deep and/or tall shelves. I have way too much airspace in my cabinets.

I only have one very short extension cord on the floor to a freestanding bench. The cord is the heavy duty flat kind and I have it in one of those rubber casings that lets stuff roll over it.

Oddly enough, I am adding a small bench - a carving bench on a pedestal (bar table base). It takes up very little space because I can place it near a cabinet without blocking the door. When I mallet carve, I tend to shake stuff off the bench, so nothing could spend much time on the benchtop, even if there was room. I am not talking about using the main bench for general storage; I mean other tools, plans, pencils, etc, that are part of what I am working on.

Tossing stuff is a big part of this also.

 

[maomoonshiner]

I'm assuming you have wood storage...?

If not, here's an idea. My 'shop' is tucked in my enormous bedroom, giving me about 100 feet square of sealed-away-from-normal-bedroom work space. I keep wood horizontally suspended overhead, after its seasoned itself a good bit in the shed out back. The suspensions cover about as much area on the ceiling as does the floor giving me, for the time being, plenty of proper storage space completely out of my way.

Just a thought. Good luck!

-morgan

 

[CarvedTones]

Yeah, I have an overhead rack; not a huge one, but big enough for my needs. It's also handy for clip on work lights and hanging the motor for my carver/grinder. One complication it adds is the logistics of being able to access it (something below that is stable and safe to stand on or a clear area for your ladder). I built a crude workbench that is stable enough to stand on with a purpose built step/rung between the legs on one end to make it easy to climb up on the bench.

 

[maomoonshiner]

Dang -- blew my suggestion away and added a plus one taboot! I like your step ladder/bench combo. I could make use of that idea...I'm thinking of making an L-shape bench in the spring into which a little step up would fit nicely. As it is, I'm 6'4"ish and don't really have a problem reaching up to the rack mounted on my 8 foot ceiling; BUT every once in a while when I want something out of the top compartment that's odd-shaped or more dense than normal -- well I guess you can imagine the string of curses I let loose in the process.

One question -- how wide are your benches? I want to go as shallow as possible to save space, but I don't want bench work with large pieces a hassle. Thanks.

Morgan

 

[CarvedTones]

One question -- how wide are your benches? I want to go as shallow as possible to save space, but I don't want bench work with large pieces a hassle.

My largest one is new as part of this shop reorg - it is 2' x 7' against a wall. It is actually two existing cabinets with a door on top of them. My freestanding bench is only 18" x 48" or so, but I also have a 2' x 2' top for my work mate, a melamine/MDF overlay for my TS and a very small but free standing carving bench. But I generally do not work with large pieces.