What makes TS inserts grow????

[RandyJ]

This has me stumped:dontknow:!
I have a Delta Contractor Table Saw purchased about 3 years ago. I replaced the standard inset with a Zero clearance insert almost immediately. Now, 3+ years later, I tried to put the original insert back and it's too BIG!
I've checked/cleaned both the insert and the opening in the saw top. I even sanded around the edges of the insert HOPING the red paint had somehow swelled:roll:. Still doesn't fit>
Has anyone ever seen this before? How can a steel/metal insert swell? Should I just scrap it and build another?
Thanks in advance for your sage advice:notworthy::notworthy:

 

[Glennbear]

Perhaps a check of table flatness is in order, north to south and east to west. Any table warpage would change the hole size. Just my half penny of thought . If the table is "dished" that would bring insert hole ends closer together. :dontknow: Picture bending a paper plate, bending it would bring edges closer together.

 

[JackLeg]

Been cuttin' any alumwood on that thing?

:rotflm:

 

[Travis Porter]

Not trying to be a smarta$$ but are you sure that is the original insert? Other than Glenn's suggestion, I am stumped as well.

 

[RandyJ]

Glenn, The table is dead flat. I checked with a known straight-edge:icon_thum.

Reggie, I've cut nothing but "real" wood on the saw...and very little of that:eusa_booh.

Travis, I know it's the original insert. I removed it shortly after purchasing the saw and replaced it with the ZC insert. It has been stored in "NEW" condition in the bottom of the extension wing....:yes:

The only reason I tried to put it back in was to cut a 45 deg. angle since the ZC insert is for 90 deg. cuts.

It is a real conundrum....:dontknow::dontknow:

 

[JackLeg]

Randy, if you figure this one out, please let us know. You've covered all the bases my limited experience can muster. To my knowledge, metal doesn't usually grow or shrink unassisted.

 

[Alan in Little Washington]

Maybe the insert was bent or stepped on so it is thinner, BUT wider. Did you drop something on the table top causing the throat or the edge of the throat to deflect inward? You trying to put it in backwards or upside down?

 

[Travis Porter]

Is your shop heated? Have you tried it when it is cold and when it is warm out?

 

[DaveO]

Metal, especially cast iron does move a little in response to temperature changes. That is why you can heat/freeze a fitting to get it apart. I don't know if that is your problem, but it could be :dontknow:

Dave

 

[sediener]

Are you sure that the table didn't shrink? Maybe a little too much sweat dripped on it during the summer?

:rotflm:
:slap:

 

[Gofor]

If it is an aluminum insert, that may explain it as aluminum expands much more than steel or CI, but it must have been extremely close tolerance for that to happen and the weather is not that warm. I would check for a warped insert or for a shop buddy that needed to swap an insert!!:dontknow: Just smack it a couple times with the dead-blow. It probably just needs an attitude adjustment.:rolf:

Go

 

[cpowell]

This has me stumped:dontknow:!
I have a Delta Contractor Table Saw purchased about 3 years ago. I replaced the standard inset with a Zero clearance insert almost immediately. Now, 3+ years later, I tried to put the original insert back and it's too BIG!
I've checked/cleaned both the insert and the opening in the saw top. I even sanded around the edges of the insert HOPING the red paint had somehow swelled:roll:. Still doesn't fit>
Has anyone ever seen this before? How can a steel/metal insert swell? Should I just scrap it and build another?
Thanks in advance for your sage advice:notworthy::notworthy:

Isn't there a set screw on one end of those Delta inserts...maybe it's hanging up?

I dunno, if the insert is growing I wouldn't wanna put it in, in another few years it'd likely crack the top. :rotflm: :rotflm:

Scrap it and build another. Those stock inserts are okay if rip width and the offcut are WIDE, otherwise they are an exercise in evaluating random projectile motion of wood at high velocities, and occasionally generating very neat sounds as wood is wedged then sucked through the hole/blade.

I replaced my original insert with a Delta ZCI and occasionally fill with epoxy and re-cut to get re-establish zero clearance.


Chuck

 

[RandyJ]

Thanks for all the suggestions and wise-cracks:laugh:

I haven't been sweating enough to shrink the table:roll:.

The shop is heated and cooled. No change with temp swings.

If I can figure out how to make a ZCI for 45 degree cuts:dontknow:, I'll do that.

Thanks again...This site is great!!!

 

[cpowell]

Thanks for all the suggestions and wise-cracks:laugh:

I haven't been sweating enough to shrink the table:roll:.

The shop is heated and cooled. No change with temp swings.

If I can figure out how to make a ZCI for 45 degree cuts:dontknow:, I'll do that.

Thanks again...This site is great!!!

Maybe you could touch up the insert with a disk sander/stationary belt sander/grinder. Just mark with a pencil at the bind points. Shouldn't take much and you only use it for bevels anyway. Just a thought.

Yep, I use the stock insert for beveled cuts, too, and they aren't always 45 degrees, huh?


Chuck

 

[Joe Scharle]

No comment, just want to be notified when then answer comes up.

 

[Alan in Little Washington]

Before this thread dies- my brother (also a tinkerer :-D ) is adding stepper motors, gears, cog belts, computer interface, etc. etc. to convert his Bridgeport mill to a CNC mill.

One of the first things he is going to machine for me is a tablesaw throat plate; an aluminum throat plate that will accept removable wood inserts so you can have multiple, inexpensive, zero clearance inserts with the same plate, easily change the insert for different blades and angles, and easily make you own replacement wood inserts. It will likely look something like the Wood Dynamics insert pictured below that Norm used on the NYW. It is no longer available since Wood Dymanics folded a few years back.

I don't know if my brother would be interested in making more and selling them, and if so, what he would charge (I think the originals were a bit pricey at around $120 - $140).

I would like to know what kind of interest you guys might have in something like this?

 

[SteveHall]

I've wondered about these for a while, wouldn't it be possible to make both parts out of wood? I'm imagining the insert part being keyed lengthwise into the base portion.

 

[Jim Murphy]

easily change the insert for different blades and angles

I, for one, might be interested in having one for my PM66 series saw, but I have been struggling with how one accurately, safely and efficiently makes the initial cut for bevel angles. With that dilemma solved, wouldn't the orientation/size of the slot change as the depth of cut varied, even when the bevel angle remained constant?

 

[garymuto]

I really doubt it a temperature delta issue. Would have bet warpage, but it sounds like both parts are flat. Could it be oxidation?

 

[Alan in Little Washington]

I, for one, might be interested in having one for my PM66 series saw, but I have been struggling with how one accurately, safely and efficiently makes the initial cut for bevel angles. With that dilemma solved, wouldn't the orientation/size of the slot change as the depth of cut varied, even when the bevel angle remained constant?

Yup. That is why you need replaceable inserts. Though a few degrees either way won't enlarge the zci enough to make a difference.