Urea-formaldehyde Glue

[Mike Wilkins]

Read the article in the recent past issue of Fine Woodworking mag on the best glues for different applications. I have a bent lamination project in the works and I need some of this glue. The local big box stores (Lowes and HD) do not have it in the Greenville, NC area.
Any of you guys know of a source, other than mail order for some of this glue?
All of the info on glues I have read state that good-ole yellow glue is not the best glue for bent laminations, due to its tendency to creep. And I don't want my project to explode at a later date. This is not a severe radius, just a gentle sweep.
Thanks for any assistance. Mike.

 

[RandyJ]

Mike, You can get it in Raleigh at both Woodcraft and Klingspor's WW store. I know that doesn't help you down in Winterville, but maybe the NCWW express could help out. I would offer to help, but I'm leaving in the AM for a week in Canada:eusa_danc .
Take care,

 

[Phillip]

mike, my local ace hardware carries a dap brand urea formaldehyde glue, maybe one in your area will as well. if your arch is locked in place i don't think creep would be a problem, such as a door jamb. on the other hand, something like a rocker for a chair would be a good place to use uf glues. good luck.

phillip

 

[McRabbet]

Mike, the best stuff for your application is available from Woodworker's Supply in Graham -- check it out at this link. This is the water-soluble glue that John Richards (Woodguy1975) uses in his Maloof Chair Making classes to glue up the laminated walnut rockers. It has a shelf life of a year and is not that expensive.

Rob

 

[SkintKnuckle]

Mike, I worked at the plant and lab who produced the exact product sold by Woodworkers for more years than I want to admit.

You may find UF resin a bit more difficult to deal with than PVA wood glues. The viscosity will be significantly lower, more in the line with what you'll see using Gorrilla glue types. In addition the cured glue line will be MUCH more brittle than a PVA glue. So your laminate stock will need to be much tighter fitting, and have very good clamp pressure along the entire glue liine. Also bear in mind that once mixed, these resins are pre-catalyzed and will remain liquid from 8 to 12 hours, then will either be too thick to use or even solid.

One little advertised tidbit is that these products also have limited shelf life, even in dry form. So check to make sure the product you're buying is not over a year old.

UF resin systems will meet a type 2 spec, which means that they can be only very intermittently exposed to mositure. To put it in a little better context, Titebond 2 is designed to meet this same spec (and btw, I'm not affilated with Franklin who produces Titebond). If you bent wood is going in some outside furniture, you should consider either a PRF system, epoxy, or Gorrilla glue type, or at the very least Titebond 3.

As far as bond strength goes, a good PVA glue will give greater bond strenght than a UF resin, assuming both are properly used.

If the project were mine, and is intended for inside use, I'd go with a good PVA. The only drawback is the fact that you must work quickly when assembling and clamping your laminate to prevent dry out. I would apply the glue to both surfaces, to assure good transfer.

If you want a little more info on the UF system, and are still committed to using it and still can't find it, drop me a PM. I may be able to help you out.

 

[DavidF]

If I could get it to you I would give you a pound of the UF glue I have (the one from woodworkier supply) they only supply 5 pounds at a time and I only needed a small amount. Can you get anywhere near Pittsboro?

 

[woodguy1975]

LOL I have 15 lbs of that glue in my shop if you get around Hickory.

 

[Mike Wilkins]

Thanks for the tips/info/purchase locations. This is what I like about visiting these type forums. I will be in Raleigh soon to pick up the vacuum veneering system that is in their sales flyer, so I will see if they have it.
Hey PappJ-since you are going to Canada, do you know Cuban cigars are legal there?? Sounds tempting???

 

[Howard Acheson]

Mike, here is where I get my UF adhesive ==> Jamestown Distributors. They have a small container and a large container.

In the shop I was involved with all our unsupported bent laminations were done with UF adhesive. PVA has the weakness that it is relatively weak in shear strength--in other words, it slips--so laminations tend to want to unbend over time. UF adhesives do not have this characteristic so they are the most often used adhesives for bent laminations. They are also used frequently used for non-submerged marine applications for such things as rudder handles.
UF adhesives are also better than PVA's for panel glue ups. A frequent complaint is that the gluelines seems to swell after a period of time. This is a characteristic of PVA adhesives when the panel goes through a complete seasonal humidity change. The wood swells pulling the adhesive up with it. However, when the wood again shrinks, the glue itself remains raised and can be easily felt with the fingertips. We had lots of callbacks on this issue back in the early eighties. We spent many days over a couple of years with our adhesive supplier attempting to resolve this problem. The answer for us was to switch to UF adhesive for panel glue-ups. I still see complaints about raised gluelines so the problem is still there with today's PVA adhesive.

PVA adhesives are the best all round adhesives and their ability to slightly "give" is a benefit with some joints. PVA adhesive will do a better job with M&T joints where seasonal movement can be tolerated without reduction of strength or failure. Brittle adhesives like hide glue. I used PVA adhesives for all my non-panel construction applications.