Table saw blade warping

RedBeard

Burns
Corporate Member
I’ve had an ongoing issue with my hybrid Grizzly table saw for a while now and despite my best efforts I can’t figure out how to fix it. . When I install the blade the it warps in the middle at the arbor. It’s like a really shallow bowl. It is a full kerf Diablo. I have a Woodpeckers SRX straight edge and the blade is dead flat. I install it, making sure not to overtighten and check it again and it is close to .02 from front of the blade to the middle. The front and back of the blade is in line with each other. I do the standard alignment of the blade to the miter slot using the same tooth front and back to line it up flush using a dial caliper in the miter slot. I lined up the blade to be about .002 open from the back of the fence based on the tooth location from miter slot set up. With everything lined up the warp in the blade is is pushing the stock to left away from the fence. When I try to muscle it through with assistance from feather boards (in front of the blade), grriper, riving knife, and using my free hand (as safely as I can) to push it against the fence behind the blade, it is wanting to push the wood out away from the fence. If I put enough pressure on the back I can get it pretty close but it is very difficult and ends up burning. The runout on the arbor is minimal as is the blade wobble. The only thing I can come up with is that maybe the plate the blade sits against on the arbor has a cup in it and when tightened is causing the cup? The only idea I’ve had is possibly to get a blade stabilizer plate and install on the arbor side to try and see if that would help flatten it out. I apologize for the lengthy post but I’m just trying to put all the information in that I can as I feel like I’ve tried everything. I appreciate any help you guys can give me.
 

RedBeard

Burns
Corporate Member
I haven’t tried different brands but it has shown up in 2 Diablos. I just put a new one on about a week ago.
 

jlwest

Jeff
Corporate Member
If it happens to all blades it sounds like the blade plate on the arbor is not milled flat. A out of square fence, relative to the blade, will also do it. Does a regular crosscut come out square?
 

RedBeard

Burns
Corporate Member
doing it with cross cuts as well but is less of an issue as the distance being cut isn’t all that long and I can usually offset it better with hold down clamps on my miter gauge plus I can get a better grip on the whole piece. So I can get the CrossCuts to come out square. Fence is straight. Checked it with straight edge and dial caliper out of miter slot. My thought has been that there was an issue with the arbor plate. I didn’t know if anyone else had run across this issue because I have been unable to find anything anywhere on the interwebs describing this issue. I’ve spent more hours than I care to mention trying to work through this. I would rather not replace the arbor if there was a simpler fix. I’d rather not have to use a blade stiffener as they will ultimately limit my depth of cut but am just unsure of what else I could do.
 
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nn4jw

New User
Jim
If the arbor and nut are actually deforming the blade I'd think that you could measure the same cupping of the blade with the blade mounted backwards. Of course you wouldn't apply power at all trying that. Relative to the blade the cupping should be in the opposite direction. Relative to the saw it should be in the same direction both times. In other words, if the edges of the blade are closer to the fence than the center now and you reverse mount the blade and tighten it the same if the arbor is the cause the edges of the blade would still be close to the fence.

If the cup direction reverses with the blade reversed then the blade is the culprit, not the arbor.
 
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Jeff

New User
Jeff
I’ve had an ongoing issue with my hybrid Grizzly table saw for a while now
Specifically which model do you have? How long has it been doing this (from day 1out of the box or just recently)?

With everything lined up the warp in the blade is is pushing the stock to left away from the fence.
Can you see this push away? Maybe your rip fence is out of alignment (toed in) at the back end which can cause binding and burning.

I'd set aside the Diablo blades and buy a higher quality full kerf blade.
 

RedBeard

Burns
Corporate Member
Reversing the blade is a good idea to confirm if the problem is the arbor.

I have the G0771 not the newer G0771z.

The wood follows the blade flush and pulls it away from the fence. When I can get enough pressure to keep the piece flush to the fence all the way across you can see the wood touch the front and back of the blade and a small gap in the middle.

The fence and blade are aligned as they can be considering the warp. I have the rear of the fence flared out away from the blade about .003.

I’m unsure if it’s always been like this. I bought it used about 4 years ago. I have always had issues with it not cutting square but had chalked it up to the terrible stock fence and was able to work through it for the most part. Some more detailed projects got pretty frustrating though.

I upgraded the fence late last year and it’s great but that’s what triggered me going through everything trying to fine tune it. I assumed once I got a fence that would hold its position and actually lock in square every time my issues would disappear. Once that wasn’t the fix, I started ruling out everything I could find until I finally came across this warping issue.
 

GregB

New User
Greg
Try swapping the arbor plates. If one was milled wrong it should then pull your work to the right.
Are the arbor plates flat where they hold the blades or are they milled out with low spots?
Like Jeff said, try another blade.
If you reach in and grab the arbor and give it a tug does it move? Could there be a lose motor mount or too much play in the bearings? Does it make a whining or growling noise when running?
How long have you had the saw? Is it new or used?
 

Gofor

Mark
Corporate Member
Are you certain the riving knife/splitter is completely behind the blade? If it is too wide, or off center, it will pull the work.
 

RedBeard

Burns
Corporate Member
Greg - I suspected the plate between blade and nut was the issue to start with because it had a slight bow in it but I flattened it out and did nothing to fix the problem. The plate on the arbor side is fixed to the arbor. No movement on the arbor when I grab it. No vibration, noise in the motor, whining, or growling. Only problem with the motor is I wish it was bigger. Had the saw for around 4 years. Bought it used. I know Forrest and Ridge carbides are awesome blades but is the steel that much higher a quality that they would resist deflection under pressure from a deformed arbor plate? I’m using full kerf blades now and my concern is without fixing whatever the issue is would long term use of that blade eventually ruin it? I’m just afraid of ruining the blade and having to replace it yearly. I may end up at least trying it mostly because I’ve been looking for an excuse to drop the money on WWII.

Gofor - the kerf on the riving knife is good. It did have a bow to it at one point but I fixed it. It’s right inline with the blade. The issue is really the flex in the blade. I put splitters in one of my zero clearance inserts to use instead of the riving knife just to make sure I didn’t miss something.
 

junquecol

Bruce
User
I'm over in Apex / Holly Springs area. If you can come over here, I will lend you a jig to check fixed side of arbor flange run out, and show you how to fix it. I can also lend you a "known good" blade. FYI, I have a freshly sharpened WWI that I'm was going to sell at spring picnic, along with several other blades.
 

Bernhard

Bernhard
User
Do you have a dial test indicator? You then can sweep the arber, flange with and w/o saw blade installed to track down the culprit. From the posts it appears that the flansh/back plate is not flat.
Cheers,
Bernhard
 

GregB

New User
Greg
Agree, it sounds to me like a bad fitting arbor plate that causes the blade to warp when the arbor nut is torqued. This warping or dishing would be more noticeable on blades made from thinner material. I would try another arbor plate and also heavier blade and see if either ends the warping. Do not use a fender washer or any other shim that is not machined properly and designed for this as it could permanently damage the saw and yourself. If the blades are permanently warped after installing then do not use those either.
 

RedBeard

Burns
Corporate Member
Bruce!! My new favorite person. I just sent you a private message.

This was the first time I’ve ever posted and am truly appreciative to everyone that responded. I’m still open to suggestions if anyone has any but whenever I get this figured out I’ll you know how it turned out. Thanks again.
 

Jeff

New User
Jeff
plate thicknesskerf width
Diablo 0.071 0.098
Freud LU72R010 0.087 0.126
I would try another arbor plate and also heavier blade and see if either ends the warping.
He's using a full kerf blade already so how do you go thicker (heavier) than that?
 

Willemjm

Willem
Corporate Member
I always use a special thick arbor plate with an imbedded O/Ring against the blade. It fits between the stock arbor plate and the blade. It is a flat precision machined disk, thick with an O-Ring groove and an Oring.
 
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