Single stage dust collector suggestions

[HMH]

I am on a mission to improve the dust collection/ air quality in the shop.

For background, my shop consists of a 2 car garage, (25'x22'), with all of the power tools concentrated to one side. I would LIKE to run approx. 20' of 5" PVC ductwork and keep the DC parked near the garage door for extra ventilation, (and closest to the TS, jointer, and planer). That being said, I am considering moving the DC to the rear of the shop and venting outside, (assuming the HOA wont notice a 5" port on the back of the house - I'm thinking "strategic boxwoods"). Either way, I will be adding a Thien baffle before the impeller, and assuming I do not vent outside, a Wynn filter.

I have skimmed Mr. Pentz website, and while I find the info very useful, and fully understand the benefits of the system, and my assumed risk in choosing not to adopt, I do not have the tool budget, nor do I get enough shop time to justify a full blown cyclone system.

I just bought a Jet afs-1000b, (that thing is awesome) to take care of the airborne issues.

Now I'm onto the DC itself. I would love to keep it around the $300 mark, (cheap I know) but can potentially bump that a bit if a particular unit is an exceptional bang for the buck. I have no problem w/ the used market, but I havent seen many DC's pop up lately, and I would prefer to take care of this sooner rather than later.

So let's hear it folks - experience/ recommendations?

 

[manfre]

Get permission to put up an evergreen shrub that would block the view of the exhaust port and the soon to be created pile of sawdust. It should also help a little bit with muffling the noise that escapes through the hole. You will definitely have a much easier time getting your HOA to approve new plants.

 

[JimmyC]

Heath,

I have a Grizzly G1029z and it will easily handle your needs, and if you aren't going to vent outside then buy the G0548Z (the cost is a little more, but you won't have to buy a wynn filter. If you can vent outside then the G1029 will easily do your amount of ductwork even with 6" pipe. Definitely use a Thien either way. There will be very little discharge with this set up

Good luck,

Jimmy

http://www.grizzly.com/products/2-HP-Dust-Collector-with-2-5-Micron-Bag-and-New-Impeller/G1029Z2

http://www.grizzly.com/products/2HP-Canister-Dust-Collector/G0548Z

 

[SteveHall]

Heath,

The chief problem with venting outdoors is that an equal amount of "makeup air" will need to infiltrate back into the space to replace the exhausted volume. This is no problem with an unconditioned shop, but if you are paying for heating or cooling, it takes only a minute to completely replace all the air in your shop with unconditioned outside air. Assuming your shop is 9' tall, you have 5,000 cubic feet... which takes only 3.2 minutes to empty with Jimmy's Grizzly!

I feel that's the primary reason for filtered return systems. Most of the other issues are easily solved such as having the unit indoors to keep down the sound and putting a course filter outside to contain major dust. (You could even put up a short stack to solve air quality concerns of the neighbors.) But the bottom line is that the air of your shop is being dumped outside and new unconditioned air has to replace it.

I'm convinced two cheap HF dust collectors could be combined to generate the CFM for quality dust collection. Combined with Thien Baffles and 0.5 micron filters, it isn't that expensive to get pull 1,000 CFM or so.

What have you figured for the ductwork? I'm still looking for a source for 6" PVC S&D pipe...

 

[Glennbear]

My thoughts based upon my 3 years experience in my current 24x24 garage/shop:

1) Partially based upon tests run by Wood magazine where they tested 15 machines in the class and it tied for first place I chose the Delta 50-760. There have been several other positive reviews.

2)Because the impeller empties directly into the bag housing without an intervening elbow I feel it is more efficient.

3) My shop is plumbed with 4" PVC, I originally planned on 5" transitioning to 4" but finding 5" became problematic. I should note that I only have the gate open for one machine at a time and keep the connecting hoses from the gates to the machines as short as possible.

4) I use a trash can seperator when using the planer because of the chip volume but the rest of the machines directly feed into the DC piping.

I have been happy with the performance of my system which is supplemented by a Jet ceiling mounted air cleaner. I have the DC in a closet with my compressor for sound control. If you want more info about my specific system I have posted a few threads over the years or just ask away. :wsmile:

 

[Bas]

If possible, definitely vent outside. It means you don't have to buy an expensive filter, and performance will be much better. Yes, you lose any heated/ cooled air, but that's not terrible unless it's really warm or really cold. It takes quite a while for all the equipment to cool down/ heat up, even with all of the air being replaced every few minutes. And with a separator + baffle, very little dust will escape. I doubt anyone in the neighborhood will notice (and if they do, give them a cutting board )

I have never seen PVC in 5", only 4" and 6". You'd have to go with metal if you want to stick with 5". If you decide to drop down to 4", the pipe and fittings are cheap and plentiful. 6" is expensive and harder to find.

 

[Glennbear]

After my first post in this thread another thought occurred to me, besides the loss of conditioned air when exhausting to the exterior if you work with Walnut the dust/chips are toxic to vegetation. :wconfused: This may have some bearing on using "green camouflage". :wsmile:

 

[JimmyC]

Heath,

The chief problem with venting outdoors is that an equal amount of "makeup air" will need to infiltrate back into the space to replace the exhausted volume. This is no problem with an unconditioned shop, but if you are paying for heating or cooling, it takes only a minute to completely replace all the air in your shop with unconditioned outside air. Assuming your shop is 9' tall, you have 5,000 cubic feet... which takes only 3.2 minutes to empty with Jimmy's Grizzly!

I feel that's the primary reason for filtered return systems. Most of the other issues are easily solved such as having the unit indoors to keep down the sound and putting a course filter outside to contain major dust. (You could even put up a short stack to solve air quality concerns of the neighbors.) But the bottom line is that the air of your shop is being dumped outside and new unconditioned air has to replace it.

I'm convinced two cheap HF dust collectors could be combined to generate the CFM for quality dust collection. Combined with Thien Baffles and 0.5 micron filters, it isn't that expensive to get pull 1,000 CFM or so.

What have you figured for the ductwork? I'm still looking for a source for 6" PVC S&D pipe...

You're absolutely right about conditioned air being emptied out, but that's not a problem for me because it's cold air in the winter and hot in the summer :gar-La;. You also will have to worry if you have any H/W/H or furnace with a pilot on it in the shop.

 

[JimmyC]

After my first post in this thread another thought occurred to me, besides the loss of conditioned air when exhausting to the exterior if you work with Walnut the dust/chips are toxic to vegetation. :wconfused: This may have some bearing on using "green camouflage". :wsmile:

It might happen, but there is so little dust vented outside unless you overfill the DC.

 

[Transplanted]

I've got my DC from Penn State Industries. Although it's 1.5hp, and underpowered for your needs, has served me well for several years. Point being, they are very well made, and their CS is great. They have some great cyclone units as well. One thing I did upon purchasing was to get the remote for it. Best accessory I bought. Just another option to consider.
Stan

 

[Leviblue]

I also went with the Delta 50-760. This thing really sucks in a good way. I've only used it for a short time, but have been very pleased with it compared to my previous system. It comes with a 1 micron top bag and a clear bottom bag. The removal and installation is easy. Amazon has the best price but a local wood working store may be able to help you as well.
This unit has the "Y" connector for two machines, or multiple lines connected to the 4" ports. But you also have the option to use it without the "Y" port and duct to a 5" inlet. The unit can operate either port down or port up. It's more than I need for my garage shop and the noise is not as bad as a shop vac. My shop is like yours, I have Air Conditioning, only on the condition that the wind is blowing. :gar-Bi

 

[HMH]

Thanks for all the great feedback guys!

Venting outside is looking better and better. I don't heat or cool the shop, (other than a space heater in the winter, and a box fan in the summer), and no gas appliances so I'm good there. The garage door is far from air tight, so I don't believe that back pressure will be an issue either. From what I understand, the use of a pre-separator will really reduce the dust pumped out as exhaust, so hopefully the neighbors wont even notice.

My big decision now is the HP. If I'm going to vent outside, the filter is out of the equation, and the unrestricted exhaust should ramp up the suction a bit. Would 1.5HP be enough to run 20' or so of smooth walled duct? From what I gather from the Wood mag review, most of the DC's tested weren't capable of pulling enough CFM through 6" duct, so that's how I arrived at 5" - I was planning on stovepipe duct from the box.

A couple members have contacted me offering their 3HP-4 bag collectors, which I originally passed on due to their size, but if I'm trashing everything but the blower/motor, 3HP would clear a tennis ball!

Food for thought guys - keep it coming!

 

[JimmyC]

I do know that the G1029Z will work on a shop of your size with 6" piping, especially if you vent outside, Glennbear has been using his Delta 1.5hp and 4" duct without a problem, so I am sure that it would work with 5" piping if you vent outside. Venting outside has one problem other than the dust and it's the noise, I live in the country and don't find it a problem but if your neighbors are fairly close it might be.

Just food for thought,

 

[HMH]

Venting outside has one problem other than the dust and it's the noise, I live in the country and don't find it a problem but if your neighbors are fairly close it might be....,

That's a good point Jimmy. In your experience, does the majority of the noise come from the exhaust, or the fan itself? I was thinking of leaving the blower and motor assembly inside, mounted on the inside of the rear wall of the garage, with a short, (12" or so) duct running through the wall and venting outside. I was thinking/hoping this would keep the majority of the noise inside w/ me. I do live in a neighborhood, but I have some space, from the rear corner of my garage, where I am planning to vent the DC to the nearest corner of the neighbor's deck is approx. 65'-70' w/ a row of Cypress in between.

Thanks again for all the feedback! It's a lot easier to modify the plan before the sawsall and hole saw come out.....

 

[kooshball]

Not to get sidetracked, but regardless of your choice leave some money in the budget for a good respirator. I have the HP 2HP DC with a Wynn filter and get good suction (search my previous posts for actual CFM data); but a wear a P100 North respirator as well....and I never get stuffy no matter how long I stay in the shop.

 

[MarkE]

As far as noise with an outside vented DC, I can't see where it would be any louder than venting inside with windows or garage doors opened.

If you are going to vent outside with a pre-separator, make sure you check the barrel often. If it gets over full, the blower will suck the chips right out of it and into your yard. Then the neighbors will certainly notice. I have done this with my DC and Thein separator and filled the plastic collection bags over half full before I noticed. If all that stuff went outside, it would make a good sized pile.

 

[JimmyC]

That's a good point Jimmy. In your experience, does the majority of the noise come from the exhaust, or the fan itself? I was thinking of leaving the blower and motor assembly inside, mounted on the inside of the rear wall of the garage, with a short, (12" or so) duct running through the wall and venting outside. I was thinking/hoping this would keep the majority of the noise inside w/ me. I do live in a neighborhood, but I have some space, from the rear corner of my garage, where I am planning to vent the DC to the nearest corner of the neighbor's deck is approx. 65'-70' w/ a row of Cypress in between.

Thanks again for all the feedback! It's a lot easier to modify the plan before the sawsall and hole saw come out.....

Hey Heath,
The fan is much louder than the exhasut, and the Pentz site has aplan for a muffler if needed. Just aim the exhaust down instead of out, and don't forget to put screening on it for small critters. I was mentioning the sound mostly if you were a driveway away from your neighbors.

Good luck,