Shelix Head - Caveat Emptor

DIYGUY

New User
Mark
Long story - I will try to be brief. I have a Steel City thickness planer bought 10 years back, with a carbide cutterhead. It's similar but not identical to the Shelix head. The main difference is that instead of spiral cutter placements they are inline and parallel to the bed. All works well. A while back as part of the regular 'sharpening' I rotated the cutters 90 degrees. In the process, the Torx t-handle head that engages the threads of the mounting screws stripped both itself and the screw I was attempting to remove. Ugh! Fast forward many moons and I have finally decided to remedy this. Today, I drilled out the stripped screw and successfully removed it. In my search for a replacement I discovered that Steel City went out of biz 5 years back. I had a brain cramp that perhaps I could source the very unique and hard to find screws through a Shelix part from Byrd.

I checked their website and the screws look to be identical, although I cannot say for certain. I called their support line for information. I was told that I could order 10 screws for a flat fee of $15. Ouch! I only need one so this was a painful decision, however, there wasn't another place to find these screws, so I bit my lip and said okay. Ready for this? After passing my CC the price was $25! I learned that I mistakenly thought the 'flat fee' of $15 was for the part. Instead if was for the privilege of placing an order. The parts were $10.40 additional. NET: a single replacement screw is a very expensive item to be had. To add to my misery, I can only hope that they are going to fit.

Lesson to be learned - if you want to own a Shelix cutterhead expect to pay Mercedes prices for parts.
 

Hmerkle

Board of Directors, Development Director
Hank
Staff member
Corporate Member
This is an open offer - if anyone has a question about screws on this site, I will be happy to help.
Unfortunately, distance is a problem, but I can try to talk you through it...

I have 28 years experience in fasteners - there is no magic, yes, some screws may be hard or even impossible to find and you have to go back to the manufacturer for them...

But in this case, it is likely a metric countersunk hex or torx drive screw.
They are typically made with a 90 degree head and in this case since the machine was made overseas, the screws are likely metric...

I don't have faith in Fastenal anymore, there used to be REALLY great people there who could help, but if you have a local distributor with a "Will Call" window (ours here in Greenville is Carson Nut bolt and tool - Carson's Nut-Bolt & Tool Co.)
They have the knowledge to help.

To check the thread any home depot or Lowes has a male / female thread checker wehre you can check the thread of your screw.

Now, full disclosure - I had a LSS Starrett parallel and it was missing the screws - I paid $17 for two of them... because they ARE THAT special!
 

Charlie

Charlie
Corporate Member
Mark,
You should have asked for help on this site. I have the Byrd Shelix heads in my planer and jointer and I have extra screws. May not be the same as yours but I am in Raleigh
 

DIYGUY

New User
Mark
Mark,
You should have asked for help on this site. I have the Byrd Shelix heads in my planer and jointer and I have extra screws. May not be the same as yours but I am in Raleigh
Thanks Charlie, if you are open to letting me compare one of mine to one of yours I will gladly pay for the coffee! PM me if your schedule permits ...
 

DIYGUY

New User
Mark
In case anyone is interested, this is what Byrd uses for their carbide cutter attachment screws ...
1640173606623.png
 

Hmerkle

Board of Directors, Development Director
Hank
Staff member
Corporate Member
Not sure what length but it looks like you couldve gotten 50 for alot less....
Need to verify if that head taper is 82 degrees or 90 degrees... (but it is likely it is the 82 deg.)
 

charlessenf

(;harles
Senior User
Long story - I will try to be brief. I have a Steel City thickness planer bought 10 years back, with a carbide cutterhead. It's similar but not identical to the Shelix head. The main difference is that instead of spiral cutter placements they are inline and parallel to the bed. All works well. A while back as part of the regular 'sharpening' I rotated the cutters 90 degrees. In the process, the Torx t-handle head that engages the threads of the mounting screws stripped both itself and the screw I was attempting to remove. Ugh! Fast forward many moons and I have finally decided to remedy this. Today, I drilled out the stripped screw and successfully removed it. In my search for a replacement I discovered that Steel City went out of biz 5 years back. I had a brain cramp that perhaps I could source the very unique and hard to find screws through a Shelix part from Byrd.

I checked their website and the screws look to be identical, although I cannot say for certain. I called their support line for information. I was told that I could order 10 screws for a flat fee of $15. Ouch! I only need one so this was a painful decision, however, there wasn't another place to find these screws, so I bit my lip and said okay. Ready for this? After passing my CC the price was $25! I learned that I mistakenly thought the 'flat fee' of $15 was for the part. Instead if was for the privilege of placing an order. The parts were $10.40 additional. NET: a single replacement screw is a very expensive item to be had. To add to my misery, I can only hope that they are going to fit.

Lesson to be learned - if you want to own a Shelix cutterhead expect to pay Mercedes prices for parts.
As others have likely said, a screw is a screw. It is highly improbable that your 'Mercedes' screws were made by Mercedes. Rather source from manufacturers of threaded parts identical or similar in design, material, thread, head, etc. leaving only the length and diameter making them 'unique.'

I have a PMJ300 Starting Capacitor purchased off Amazon because I did not notice it wasn't a PRIME offer and the return shipping negated the incentive of a refund. Buyer Pays Return Shipping is, or should be) a strong incentive to do a bit more research. Over the years I've seen several folks recommend McMaster Carr for the odd part and find their catalog overwhelming - similar to Grainger's offerings.

I noticed that, on your order, it specified 10-32 Torx Plus Screws - but no length was mentioned. Searching for that string I found a hundred from MCS Direct for $23 listed as "#10-32 UNF Torx Plus 82° Flat Socket Cap Screw Alloy Steel, Black Oxide, Fully Threaded, 3/8" Overall Length." No idea if they fit your particular tool, but share as yet another source as well as an indication of a full description of the part required.

As to the thought of purchasing 100 #10-32 UNF Torx Plus 82° Flat Socket Cap Screw Alloy Steel, Black Oxide, Fully Threaded, 3/8" Overall Length screws to replace one, try an End Run. I equipped my shop with eight foot fluorescent fixtures (they simply plug into duplex outlets mounted in the bright white ceiling) before LED became so popular and cheap. I would purchase the fixtures second hand because, after all is said and done, "no one owns anything new for long." These fixtures, however, employ (4) weird clip/twist fasteners to secure the covers to the base and no one sells just one! So, I wrote a letter to a company that sells fixtures and, low and behold - a week or to later a small package arrives in our mail box containing a hundred of the things! Postage paid and no charge.

Write to McMaster Car and ask them to ship you one screw. You spend a bit of time and fifty-four cents and are likely to get a little package of two.

Remember, "If you don't ask, they can't say "Yes""
 

charlessenf

(;harles
Senior User
That's government math!
No, actually, the government legislates something called Unit Pricing - those of you with 20-20 may have seen the results in the smallest printing on the shelf labels.

The idea being that Unit Pricing will help the Mathematically Challenged determine which bag of rice offers the best value as between 'brands' and weight (or volume in the case of Rice Milk, say). Consumer groups actually went to bat to get Unit Pricing into law. So, that's "Government Math." Folks would be able to compare the cost of a gallon of chocolate (flavored) milk with a gallon of the low fat alternative - even if the chocolate flavored stuff was packaged in 10.2 oz containers.

Commercial interests, however, seldom align with those of a frugal gourmet and so, we have Unit Pricing examples that, while technically meeting the requirements of legislation (often written in consultation with if not by the manufacturers lobbyists e.g. Sackler Perdue Pharma) result in selling you a pound of (Campbells Chicken Noodle) "Umm Umm Good Soup" but only offering ice cream by liquid (volumetric) measure to do another type of end run round the the best-laid schemes o' mice or men.

But, don't get me started!
 

Robert166

robert166
Corporate Member
Charles, tell me how you really feel, and don't hold back! LOL
Seriously though, I agree with you, that is exactly what happens.
But least when I trade cars, they will pay off my trade no matter how much I owe!
Went from a shelix head cutter bolt to....... what were we talking about again?
 

DIYGUY

New User
Mark
Well, the saga has come to a bittersweet close. My thanks to all who contributed. This is so typical of me. I went to the planer today to see if the screws I ordered would fit. I opened the little storage cubby to retrieve the Torx wrench and there, taped to the inside was an envelope with four screws from an original pack of five. I guess that at some point I must have ordered them when Steel City was still around. Deeply chagrined at my mindlessness I also found that there was not one missing cutter but two. I have lost the memory of what I was doing, when or why I removed the second cutter but in any event luckily I had some extra. So, all is well in WWing land once again, be that a little poorer and feeling a lot dumber.

As for the screw - I actually had previously done all of the recommended things in my quest to find it. It's truly a unique beast as the head is crowned and not flat, and the taper is not industry standard. The thread was 10-32 though. Should anyone care to own a pack of 10 screws for a Shelix head PM me and we can make a sweet deal. They say a pic is worth a 1000 words, so here is one with the original and the Byrd that I had hoped might work. The original is shorter, but has the same threads and Torx head as the Byrd.
 

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charlessenf

(;harles
Senior User
But least when I trade cars, they will pay off my trade no matter how much I owe!

Yeah, it always made me smile when someone, upon coming home with the new car, would brag about the price he got for his clunker.

I as reacting to the "Government Math" quip. Back in the sixties I was Government Issue myself.

When you've created a government of, by and for the people you can't fairly blame it for its failures as The Government is "just following orders." We have met the enemy, and he is us. Or, at the very least our reliance upon the integrity and morality of those we elect to implement the aspirations of our better angels.

Funny how the Freedom Crowd, once firmly in control, starts legislating left and right - often restricting the freedoms and privileges of 'the others.'

Self interest both personal and corporate is as likely to bring our downfall as as the arrogance that let us build a democratic republic dependent upon such premises as created the 3/5ths rule in our much vaulted constitution. Here I sit on a Balmy seventy-one degree Winter's day in the foothills of North Carolina wondering if the climate'l get me before the A.G.E. Disease (;harles
 

charlessenf

(;harles
Senior User
Well, the saga has come to a bittersweet close. My thanks to all who contributed. This is so typical of me. I went to the planer today to see if the screws I ordered would fit. I opened the little storage cubby to retrieve the Torx wrench and there, taped to the inside was an envelope with four screws from an original pack of five. I guess that at some point I must have ordered them when Steel City was still around. Deeply chagrined at my mindlessness I also found that there was not one missing cutter but two. I have lost the memory of what I was doing, when or why I removed the second cutter but in any event luckily I had some extra. So, all is well in WWing land once again, be that a little poorer and feeling a lot dumber.



As for the screw the head is crowned and not flat, and the taper is not industry standard. The original is shorter, but has the same threads and Torx head.
taper is not industry standard
Hard to tell from the angle of your picture, is the underside of that 'crowned' head relatively flat?
Similar to #1, #4 or #5?
1640723648895.png

It appears that you purchased flat countersunk bolts (and needed a shorter truss head version):
1640724249879.png
 

DIYGUY

New User
Mark
Nice lessons to be learned - my thanks Charles! Yes, you are correct - the screw is most likely a #4 taper, though with a Torx head. It has been such a journey, I do hope it spares others some aggravation.
 

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