Shaper Origin - Is it a Serious Woodworking Tool?

[Wilsoncb]

I recently decided to take the plunge and bought a Shaper Origin. Before buying it I did some research on line and found the hype is pretty high on this thing. However I had a hard time determining if it could really handle cutting thicker hardwood. Also, the traditional woodworker in me wants to say this is kind of cheating.

The spindle is essentially a Festool 720 watt (1 hp I think) trim router. It comes with a 1/4" collet, but you can get an 8mm. I got the 8mm collet and a Whiteside upcut spiral bit. I'm working with white oak that is a little over 1" thick. The tool is really easy to operate and the software interface is very intuitive. I didn't have any problem creating .svg files it requires from my AutoCad .dxf files, but I do have some experience with this type of thing. I used a free version of Fusion 360 to convert the files. Shaper has an add in app to do the conversion and once I put the files in the Shaper cloud, they are available on the machine through my wifi.

So, is it a serious woodworking tool?
So far the results have been mixed. I have to remind myself this is only a trim level router, so I can't expect it would cut the same way I can with my 2 hp and a 1/2" bit. With that in mind, I decided to push it's limits anyway. What I found is you can do 1+ thick hardwood, but it's not always the right choice. Regardless of what you are cutting this thing seem very finicky as I'm learning to use it. There are lots of videos and information, but you really have to search for it. They really need to simply define some very basic things to help you understand what is required to run it successfully. Many of the learning examples are done in 1/4 or 1/2 Baltic birch or similar easy to cut material. Also the examples are perfect world situations that are difficult to achieve when using expensive hardwood. For example, you need a perfectly flat and smooth surface with additional room for the unit to read the domino tape. This is difficult and time consuming to set up with working with larger pieces of hardwood.

I cut 4 bow-ties and went 0 for 4. The tool has a feature that lets you offset your cut any amount you want so you can come back and do a finished cut right on your mark to clean it up. After trying this feature I don't recommend it for hardwood thicker than 1/2". Initially I did a .05" offset cuts plunging in 1/8" increments (1/4" had mixed results). The material is a little over 1" so after reaching 1" I started the final on line (no offset) cut. I have the piece taped down, but didn't want to do the final cut until that final cut was easy to do. I would have liked to remove the .05 offset in one pass, but when I tried it wasn't able to do it without auto extracting. (This thing has an auto extract feature and quickly raises the bit when it thinks you are guiding off-line). So I stepped it down 1/4" at a time to remove the .05 offset. When I got to 3/4" depth, I could feel the tool struggling to hold a straight line. Even after slowing down, it couldn't quite handle it. Sometimes when it auto extracts it will jump a bit and gouge into the good work space...and you can see the results. The combination of cuts against the grain (on a more difficult that normal piece of white oak) wasn't good. As you cut through difficult areas you are pulling hard so when you suddenly hit a softer spot it's difficult to hold the target on line. My next attempt was on a more cooperative piece and I eliminated the offset which proved successful. So I'm frustrated, but able to make it work for this.

The pic below shows the setup required to cut a larger piece (36W x 28H). This took me about 6 hours to set up and ultimately it wasn't good enough to yield decent results. I was off about 1/16" which might be acceptable for hand work (for some people, not me) but I expect +/-.03 for a device like this on a piece this big. I did the same piece with a jigsaw, template and router trim bit in less time with more accurate results. If might be possible to get better results, but ultimately, I don't think the Shaper is the right tool for this job.

In this picture you can see how an 8mm bit and a depth of 3/4" can't handle the side load. These were passes made to remove the .05 offset.

So is this tool good for serious woodworking? Let me know what you think.

 

[Mountain City Bill]

Thank you for your review. I saw a demo at the Hickory show. They routed a recess into mdf. The demonstrator said you could do a whole gymnasium floor. I should have asked if that has been done yet.

I tend to shy away from tools that involves a lot of set up time and fiddling. I have a friend that has one for making craft fair items. I think this is one of his first woodworking tools. I'm anxious to see how he likes it.

 

[Unknownroad]

As you acknowledged, it seems like the type of work you were testing it on is really stretching the capabilities of a trim router with an 8mm collet so I'm not surprised that the results were less than satisfactory. It does look like quite a faff to set up, but I would try it on some lighter-duty jobs before passing judgement. Marketing is always going to promise the world, but realistically any tool is going to be better for some jobs than others.

 

[Graywolf]

I think you should try it with a larger router, you were pushing the tool a little hard.

 

[Rwe2156]

To me, the one thing serious about it is the price. I could never justify it in my shop, and I think a pro shop would just go CNC.

 

[Michael Mathews]

I also have a Shaper Origin and I've not experienced these type of incidences. First off, 0.05 is too much in my opinion for a finish pass. I usually leave no more that 0.02" for the finish pass. I've had not issues. Another thing to note is the unit does have response time, so it's critical that you move smoothly and don't jerk the SO or it will result in a bad finish. I've done lots of projects, inlays, etc with mine and they've all turned out perfect! I checked your profile but don't see where you're located. I'd be willing to compare notes if you're not too far from Chapel Hill.

 

[Oka]

Buddy of mine has one , it is a serious tool indeed pretty cool tech......... however ....... for that cost you can just get a decent CNC and move on.

 

[Michael Mathews]

Casey, before buying my SO, I considered a CNC. But I didn't want to commit the floor space to a machine that I wouldn't be using every day since I'm just a hobby woodworker at this time. The other thing to consider here are the Pros and Cons to each piece of equipment. A CNC is bound by the limits of the X and Y axis, SO is not bound by these limits! A CNC can do 3D carving, a SO cannot do 3D carving. A SO can perfectly inlay a piece nearly anywhere you want, yes...even the middle of your living room or a gymnasium! For me, I can pack it up and store it neatly away when I'm not using it and it doesn't take up the floor space, this is one of the most critical things I was concerned with.

 

[Oka]

Good points Michael the Shaper Origin is cool and flexible but........ you are forgetting the law of cool tools, if the SO is great then having both the SO and the CNC is greater/cooler ........

I understand the limitations of the shop, expanding mine is on the list of to do.

 

[Wilsoncb]

Good points Michael the Shaper Origin is cool and flexible but........ you are forgetting the law of cool tools, if the SO is great then having both the SO and the CNC is greater/cooler ........

I understand the limitations of the shop, expanding mine is on the list of to do.

Casey, I wish I could have your attitude. I think I was raised to feel guilty if I don't just make due with what I have. I also envy Roy Underhill who probably never had that internal conflict.

 

[holstein13]

I went to the show and tried out the machine. I loved it so much that I went in and bought it on Sunday. On Tuesday and Wednesday, I made a "secret Santa" box with cut-out handles and custom engraving for my stepdaughter. I was thrilled with how easy to use and versatile the machine is. Then on Friday, they announce the second generation of SO. So I returned my machine for a refund and now await Gen II this week. I'm already dreaming of a million things I can easily do with this tool.

I'm super thrilled with SO. But I would like to comment on your use of the tool for thick hardwoods. I'm curious why you don't simply make jigs with the SO and then follow up with a more powerful router with a bearing. It seems to me that the SO is entirely underpowered for the use case you are trying, but it would be perfect for making a jig.

 

[Wilsoncb]

I'm super thrilled with SO. But I would like to comment on your use of the tool for thick hardwoods. I'm curious why you don't simply make jigs with the SO and then follow up with a more powerful router with a bearing. It seems to me that the SO is entirely underpowered for the use case you are trying, but it would be perfect for making a jig.

...Because I thought I would give it a try? You are 100% correct, next time I would use it to make the template. The problem wasn't as much the power as it was the setup time and the resulting accuracy due to an imperfect setup. To have a perfect setup I think you would have to cut a sheet of 1/2" or even 3/4" thick plywood very close to the shape of your hardwood glue up. Then you would need a big perfectly flat table to level it all. In my case to make the template (per your suggestion) setup for the SO would be easy because it's just one flat sheet. Also, it's a mirror image, so it could be made for only half the piece.

Also note: I say the power wasn't AS MUCH of the problem. It would cut it, but the SO is also limited to an 8mm bit which is barely capable in my opinion. I brought up these points on the Shaper Origin forum and received push back from quite a few folks who believe it's more than capable. To that I say you can haul a 14,000 trailer with an F-150 too...but you can't go very far for very long.

 

[holstein13]

...Because I thought I would give it a try? You are 100% correct, next time I would use it to make the template. The problem wasn't as much the power as it was the setup time and the resulting accuracy due to an imperfect setup. To have a perfect setup I think you would have to cut a sheet of 1/2" or even 3/4" thick plywood very close to the shape of your hardwood glue up. Then you would need a big perfectly flat table to level it all. In my case to make the template (per your suggestion) setup for the SO would be easy because it's just one flat sheet. Also, it's a mirror image, so it could be made for only half the piece.

Also note: I say the power wasn't AS MUCH of the problem. It would cut it, but the SO is also limited to an 8mm bit which is barely capable in my opinion. I brought up these points on the Shaper Origin forum and received push back from quite a few folks who believe it's more than capable. To that I say you can haul a 14,000 trailer with an F-150 too...but you can't go very far for very long.

Yes, that is so true. The biggest problem I see with using such a small router is the time it takes to get through your thick hardwoods. You can slow down and do it in 10 passes, but there are two problems with that. 1) it would take forever, and 2) every pass introduces more chances for errors. So then you try and take shortcuts and do it in fewer passes. This introduces additional work to the machine and causes you to push harder on a tool that isn't designed to be pressed hard. It results in a jerky motion, and that motion can not be compensated for by the gyro / self-correcting mechanism leading to poor results. If pushed too hard, the bit retracts which can lead to damaged workpieces.

The quarter-inch jigs solve all these problems. They are easy to cut and modify, allowing you to use more powerful routers with bigger shanks to process the work quickly and cleanly.

I am curious about when you bought your SO. If it's within 30 days, have you considered returning it for a full refund and getting the Gen II machine? They claim it will track more accurately and be less susceptible to random movements.

 

[Wilsoncb]

I am curious about when you bought your SO. If it's within 30 days, have you considered returning it for a full refund and getting the Gen II machine? They claim it will track more accurately and be less susceptible to random movements.

Totally agree on the template comment.

I am definitely returning the 1st gen one I have before the 30 days. My only question is if I spend another $300 for the 2nd gen (which takes the total over $3K), or get a decent bandsaw and with that money instead. My gut feeling says bandsaw...but if I was Casey, I'd get both!

 

[Echd]

Totally agree on the template comment.

I am definitely returning the 1st gen one I have before the 30 days. My only question is if I spend another $300 for the 2nd gen (which takes the total over $3K), or get a decent bandsaw and with that money instead. My gut feeling says bandsaw...but if I was Casey, I'd get both!

For that kind of money a conventional CNC would be less and provided you have the space be more generally useful... of course the space is a serious concern and there are some tasks an SO would excel at a conventional CNC could not do, but I think generally the CNC is more useful.

I can certainly think of some cool things to do with the SO. But it sounds like many of the desired tasks would be just as or more easily accomplished on a conventional CNC.

 

[Tarhead]

I've wanted a pin router for a while but have no room and rarely see single-phase versions used. I'm pretty sure I could crank out templates and have a project done quicker than I could program and wait for a small router to make multiple passes. No concern about lack of power or broken bits either.

 

[holstein13]

Totally agree on the template comment.

I am definitely returning the 1st gen one I have before the 30 days. My only question is if I spend another $300 for the 2nd gen (which takes the total over $3K), or get a decent bandsaw and with that money instead. My gut feeling says bandsaw...but if I was Casey, I'd get both!

Wait, where can you find a decent bandsaw for $300? I've got the small 9" one you see everywhere, but it wanders around too much, and I need more depth to resaw lumber. The bandsaw I want is around $1,400. For $300, I could use an oscillating spindle belt sander.

On edit: I just noticed that you said you'd take the $3,000 and buy a decent band saw. That might make more sense. In my case, I could get the band saw, oscillating sander, drum sander, and a jointer for that money.

 

[holstein13]

I've wanted a pin router for a while but have no room and rarely see single-phase versions used. I'm pretty sure I could crank out templates and have a project done quicker than I could program and wait for a small router to make multiple passes. No concern about lack of power or broken bits either.

It depends on the task—the right tool for the right job. You might find a jig to be the better tool for your projects. If you want to do engraving or CNC cutting, this Shaper Origin could be just the ticket. It's just another tool. It can't do everything well.

 

[Wilsoncb]

On edit: I just noticed that you said you'd take the $3,000 and buy a decent band saw. That might make more sense. In my case, I could get the band saw, oscillating sander, drum sander, and a jointer for that money.

Yeah, that’s the kind of thing I’m talking about.

 

[mpeele]

I have had a Shaper Origin for 2+ years and it is a "tool good for serious woodworking". To demonstrate it is I made a butter fly like the ones you had a problems with. I scratched around for a 1" piece of White Oak but could only find a piece of 1" Red Oak stair tread. I applied some double stick tape to it and stuck it down. Selected the last workspace I had used doing Toys For Tots and deleted that design. Opened a folder containing butter flys and selected a 3" one. Placed it in the top left corner of the red oak.




Switched to cut mode and set cut depth to 0.25", cut offset to 0.1" and 0.25 " cutter diameter.



Moved cut target to profile and did counter clock wise cut around butter fly.



Result of the first cut. Cut went good except where the arrow points to a retract divot. This was entirely my fault. I turned the Shaper Origin to the left such that it could not see enough dominos. I know this because in the top right corner of the display there is a domino symbol that turns partially black as it begins to loose dominos. After the retraction it was completely red.



For the second cut I only changed depth of cut to 0.5" and went around again.



This time no retraction but I need to vac out the chips. You can see a very slight step here. The dark area is actually a shadow and the step is just above it. You can see the step well in the divot area. If I had pushed out of the adjustment area it would not have been an elongated divot but a more cylinders area.




You can just blearily see the step in the end grain. If it was in focus. There is a little more step along the side. Step is just 1 or 2 thou. It would sand out.





I'm changing the depth of cut to 0.75 with a offset of 0.05". Just to clean up and get ready for final pass. You can see the partially black domino because I had Shaper Origin sitting on the domino field where it could only see a few dominos. For what I'm doing here there are no domino tape on the material I cutting. Tape pattern is on the workstation domino field.



Nice and clean 0.75" depth removing 0.05 material leaving butter fly 0.05 over sized. If anyone is actually reading this maybe they will ask why he did the cut this way.







Material I'm cutting is just a tad over 1" and the router bit I'm using has a 1" CL spec. But I'm just cutting to 0.95 because you can get burning where the shaft rubs sometimes and I didn't want to risk it. That said you can cut deeper that the bits CL and the bit shaft will function as a bearing but can leave burn marks.



Nice clean cut again.






Last and final cut. Same depth but 0.0" offset.



Final 0.95" CL removing 0.5".





I cut the butter fly loos with the band saw and would take it to router table and clean up with a 1/4" spiral bearing bit.



Only defect I can find in a little bit of tear out on the round. That's a wood fault that might be preventable by pattern orientation or taking a very shallow( 0.05") first pass if it matters.



Really interesting thing is that the off-cut side never shows any step marks. That is always the climb cut side. Origin won't allow you to do a climb cut along a path. Pockets yes, paths no.



So is this tool good for serious woodworking? For me it certainly is.