Screws that don't strip

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DSWalker

David
Corporate Member
I'm tired of the Off the Shelf crap sold at the big boxes that the head strips before you get half way into the wood, even when pre-drilling. They have some 'specialized' stuff for $3-4 per screw, but can't afford that.

I've been searching the forum and thought I had seen a thread on this, but just can't find it. If you have suggestions on where to get decent hardware, let me know. If you can find the thread and link it here that would be great as well!

I know that bolts come in different 'grades' of hardness. Are screws rated the same? Does AgSupply in Garner have them? I know they have many different grades of nuts/bolts.

Thanks
 

tri4sale

Daniel
Corporate Member
I'm tired of the Off the Shelf crap sold at the big boxes that the head strips before you get half way into the wood, even when pre-drilling. They have some 'specialized' stuff for $3-4 per screw, but can't afford that.

I've been searching the forum and thought I had seen a thread on this, but just can't find it. If you have suggestions on where to get decent hardware, let me know. If you can find the thread and link it here that would be great as well!

I know that bolts come in different 'grades' of hardness. Are screws rated the same? Does AgSupply in Garner have them? I know they have many different grades of nuts/bolts.

Thanks

depends on the screw and what you need it for. I've use their exterior decking screws for a lot of things, the ones with star heads, with no issues. Anything with a phillips head does tend to strip easier, even when I pre-drill.
 

Rushton

Rush
Senior User
Depending on the appearance you need, GRK Fasteners make the best screws I've every used. The offer their screws in a variety of configurations. Lowes carries a few of their various styles; Amazon carries many more.
 

Canuck

Wayne
Corporate Member
Try McFeely's for them. I've been buying for years from them and never a problem.
www.mcfeelys.com

+1 with the Mcfeelys! All I use are the square dive (Robertson) screws in various lengths. Never had one strip on me.

At times they offer a box of assorted screws of various lengths and gauge. Good way to try them out. Reasonably priced online as well.

Wayne
 

Jim M.

Woody
Corporate Member
Mcfeelys, I've made several purchases from them including pocket hole screws and some assortment boxes, all have great. On my last order I also bought for $15 bucks 5 lbs of mixed screws I keep on my construction trailer.
 

Stuart Kent

Stuart
Senior User
I'm tired of the Off the Shelf crap sold at the big boxes that the head strips before you get half way into the wood, even when pre-drilling. They have some 'specialized' stuff for $3-4 per screw, but can't afford that.

I've been searching the forum and thought I had seen a thread on this, but just can't find it. If you have suggestions on where to get decent hardware, let me know. If you can find the thread and link it here that would be great as well!

I know that bolts come in different 'grades' of hardness. Are screws rated the same? Does AgSupply in Garner have them? I know they have many different grades of nuts/bolts.

Thanks

Deerwood fasteners. Every cabinet shop I've ever worked in uses them and they are great. PM me and I'll send you some
 

Gotcha6

Dennis
Staff member
Corporate Member
We use Grabber screws a lot at work. The ceramic coated screws are pretty tough. I also use the deck screws to a great degree for framing and blocking. Toughest part about blocking in metal studs is finding a screw that can penetrate the light gauge stud and still give a good bite in the wood. Avoid the black drywall screws for wood if longer than 1-1/2". The longer ones will snap off at the head if the threads run all the way up. When I was in the hospital and rehab for my surgery the main thought I had going through my mind when I grabbed a grab bar was , "I hope they used the right screws!"
 

Hmerkle

Board of Directors, Development Director
Hank
Staff member
Corporate Member
David,
What are you using the screws for and what is the failure method (sounds like camout - stripping out the drive)
What drive style are you using / do you want to use?
Can you use an alternate drive style? (torx / star / six lobe - all different names for the same thing) the bit engagement is better and you have less cam-out problems.
or is the screw body breaking when you install the screw (s)
 

ehpoole

Administrator
Ethan
The issue you are experiencing is often referred to as "cam out" if you should wish to research the topic any further (at least aside from that hands-on research experience you have already acquired).

Both Phillips and traditional straight bladed screw heads are very prone to cam out just by way of their design (in the case of Phillips it was intentional to prevent overtorquing the screw or bolt), hence a big part of the reason that alternatives like Torx, Pozi-drive, Robertson (square), hex/Allen head, etc., have all been created and marketed over the years for higher torque applications. Also be aware that these days many screws that look like Phillips are actually JIS (Japanese) standard (and increasingly Pozi-drive as well, but Pozi-drive can be easily recognized by the much smaller wings in between the four major wings forming a nearly square center opening) and using a normal Phillips bit in these screws will result in one cramming out very easily, chewing up the face of the screw. You can recognize JIS screwdrivers by a flat (in the smaller sizes) at the tip where a Phillips comes to a much sharper point by comparison. But the JIS/Phillips confusion results in a lot of headaches because using Philips screwdrivers in JIS screws leads to a rather poor fit prone to cam out when you try to apply much torque due to the deeper point of the Phillips driver, and because the two look so similar superficially we tend to mix up both the screws and their drivers in our parts and toolboxes without realizing such. You can generally count on getting away with using a JIS screwdriver in place of a Phillips when mating to a Phillips screw, but not the other way around since a Phillips driver can not fully mate with a JIS screw.

However, when you need to apply enough torque to risk cam out you also have another option besides the "lowly" screwdriver and that is using an electric (usually cordless) impact driver. Impact drivers can deliver a great deal more torque without cramming out because they utilize a high impulse hammering action that exploits the inertia provided by the tool's own weight and only rotates a short distance on each strike (further reducing the risk of cam out since the but can reseat between strikes). Additionally, they avoid the usual torquing against the user that one experiences when using a typical drill/driver or cordless screwdriver -- so much so that they can be comfortably used one handed even in high torque applications.

Hope this also helps to shed some light on the topic as I know it can be quite frustrating.
 

cobraguy

Clay
Corporate Member
I have been using McMaster-Carr for fasteners, mainly due to cost. Even with shipping charges, they are cheaper than the box stores. Down side is having to plan ahead to take shipping time into account. They also have a huge selection in many grades and drive types. Other sources listed in this thread may be good as well. I'm going to check them out. Another thing I have learned over the years is to make sure the drive bit is in good shape and using the low speed on the screw gun/drill.
 

jerrye

New User
Jerry
However, when you need to apply enough torque to risk cam out you also have another option besides the "lowly" screwdriver and that is using an electric (usually cordless) impact driver. Impact drivers can deliver a great deal more torque without cramming out because they utilize a high impulse hammering action that exploits the inertia provided by the tool's own weight and only rotates a short distance on each strike (further reducing the risk of cam out since the but can reseat between strikes). Additionally, they avoid the usual torquing against the user that one experiences when using a typical drill/driver or cordless screwdriver -- so much so that they can be comfortably used one handed even in high torque applications.

Ethan is absolutely right about impact drivers.

Years ago, I was helping to change out attic stairs in my church, and had to remove a screw with a Phillips head that was stuck fast. Everyone there tried their screwdrivers and drills, to no avail, slightly stripping out the head, making camout worse. Using my recently purchased impact driver, I was able to slowly...VERY slowly...back the screw out with no issues.

This one experience convinced me of the value of impact drivers for driving screws, making it my go-to tool for this task.
 

gmakra

New User
George
Keep it simple guys grab a bar of hand soap and drag the threads across the soap which will act as a lube.
That lowers the torque required to drive the screw and should make you smell better.
Now unless of course you really need to figure out the breaking strength of fasteners compared to clamping strength have at it.
 

Jeff

New User
Jeff
+1 to both McFeely's and McMaster-Carr. Square drive screws are good for general woodworking if that's what you're looking for.

I use a DeWalt cordless drill on a low speed (aka torque) to begin with and increasing the drive speed near the end until the screw head seats nicely. The clutch on the drill will slip and click, click, click when the screw needs more torque than is being applied so up the torque incrementally but DON'T overdrive the screw. Pre-drilling the screw holes is pretty standard (and a little paraffin wax on the threads helps too, bit often isn't necessary).

McFeely's has a very handy link on their page called "select-a-screw" that's worth exploring to see what's available when you're shopping for screws and various types of them.

https://www.mcfeelys.com/how_to_select_a_screw

https://www.mcfeelys.com/screw-fastener-web-store/select-a-screw.html
 
Last edited:

Gotcha6

Dennis
Staff member
Corporate Member
Another advantage to impact drivers is the avoidance of carpal tunnel syndrome from the wrist twisting associated with using a drill versus the impact. Less fatigue too when using one all day long.
 

SubGuy

Administrator
Zach
When I have issues with cam out, I go to the 1/4" Impact. It's a lot less prone to cam out. Also I use star bits and square drives and it make a BIG difference. So I agree with Dennis.

Another advantage to impact drivers is the avoidance of carpal tunnel syndrome from the wrist twisting associated with using a drill versus the impact. Less fatigue too when using one all day long.
 

Pop Golden

New User
Pop
There's also a down side to impact drivers. I have 2, 1 is a 12 volt and the other is a 20 volt. When I was building my new work bench I was driving 3/8 inch X 6 inch lag bolts into oak. I was predrilling. The 20 volt with it's extra power was twisting the bolts into at about 5 to 5-1/2 inches left to go. The 12 volt would not even start to move the bolt. Solved with larger predrill and lots of bee's wax and the 20 volt impact.

Pop
 
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