Saw filing a new handle idea

Hmerkle

Board of Directors, Development Director
Hank
Staff member
Corporate Member
I have not sharpened enough saws to even call myself an intermediate, but one thing I have noticed is the position of your wrist to the saw plate when holding a traditional saw file and handle...

I have an idea for an alternate handle design, and want YOUR input...

What if, the file was mounted in a handle at 90 degrees so you gripped the handle like a bicycle or motorcycle handle in your hand so that the knuckles of your fist were moving back and forth to the saw plate.
In this version your wrist is in a more neutral position and the pistoning of your arm is seemingly more controllable.

My next version of this idea was to make the handle vertical in relationship to the "V" of the file as this puts your shoulder in a more neutral position when you move your hand in a filing motion...

O.K. your turn, other suggestions, support it, reject it, or puke all over it...
 

Oka

Casey
Corporate Member
Make a handle with an articulating knuckle so you can set in any position. The Handle grip should have a slight curve to it to help focus the energy/force movement from hand to file engagement
 

Chris C

Chris
Senior User
To me it seems like the solution to a problem that doesn't exist. Is a traditional file setup causing you an issue?
 

Oka

Casey
Corporate Member
Not the issue the impetus is can there be a better file handle design, the answer of course is yes just depends on what you are filing.
 

Oka

Casey
Corporate Member
.......ok I guess its true you can't teach new dogs old tricks ......... :D
 
Last edited:

Graywolf

Board of Directors, President
Richard
Staff member
Corporate Member
I suggest you actually try it and see. I think you will find that you are causing a problem rather than solving one. The file like a saw is an extension of the hand and arm, the hand is not just holding the file, it is controlling it. The amount of pressure applied to the front or the back of a tooth, that is delivered by your hand and your fingers. Sharpening a saw is an active task and is not benign. So if your shoulder is hurting then maybe adjust the height of your vise, if you sitting then sit up in your chair or try standing. If your having trouble seeing after making the adjustments then try a visor with a longer focal distance. If none of these things help then perhaps there is a medical issue or your in need of some exercise.
Try it and share your results!
 

Chris C

Chris
Senior User
Exactly.


I suggest you actually try it and see. I think you will find that you are causing a problem rather than solving one. The file like a saw is an extension of the hand and arm, the hand is not just holding the file, it is controlling it. The amount of pressure applied to the front or the back of a tooth, that is delivered by your hand and your fingers. Sharpening a saw is an active task and is not benign. So if your shoulder is hurting then maybe adjust the height of your vise, if you sitting then sit up in your chair or try standing. If your having trouble seeing after making the adjustments then try a visor with a longer focal distance. If none of these things help then perhaps there is a medical issue or your in need of some exercise.
Try it and share your results!
 

Oka

Casey
Corporate Member
OK Ill be serious.
Not necessarily, in traditional applications the file is an extension of the hand. But depends on what you are filing and where you are filing requires different ways to hold the tool because of location and access. In my real job, we often have to adapt and make jigs for this on the fly, and have. The idea that files only need straight handle, from experience I know this not to be accurate. Whether you could make a custom handle that could address these unicorn issues is an interesting idea, but not sure it would be worth the effort, but the original question raises the idea could it be done, yes it could be done. Is it worth doing?, different question.
 

Chris C

Chris
Senior User
I agree 100% that setup and use of any tool is application specific.

But we're talking specifically about sharpening a handsaw. And on that point I agree with Richard.

I have substantial collection of vintage saws...... yes I have an old tool addiction problem. I've done a good amount of sharpening. The tactile component is very important. I can feel through my fingers how the file is cutting. And my handle is just a short piece of small wood dowel. I can't imagine trying to sharpen with a file that I'm gripping like a rake handle. Maybe I'm wrong but my experience tells me that would be problematic.

And don't forget the intangibles. For example, I like to rotate my files while I'm working. I lose that ability with a fixed offset handle. Is that a big deal? Maybe not but it would be to me.

Perhaps I'm misguided but that's my $.02 worth.
 

Hmerkle

Board of Directors, Development Director
Hank
Staff member
Corporate Member
O.K.
Obviously I didn't describe it well enough...

look at the position your wrist is in to hold the file at 90ish degrees to the saw plate.
if on the other hand you could hold the file between your middle finger and ring finger your wrist is in a neutral position and doesn't put any force on the file.
In addition, your elbow seems to compensate for the wrist angle, where as if your wrist is in a neutral position the motion can come from your shoulder and maintain a strait line.

Again, maybe it doesn't make much difference to a seasoned saw-filing veteran, but for somone learning, being able to keep the file at 90 or 80 degrees to the saw plate, it seems like one less thing to concentrate on or to be concerned with when trying to sharpen a saw..

Yes Richard (@Graywolf) I intend to try it and (hopefully) film the experience!
 

Oka

Casey
Corporate Member
Ok, I come from working in lots of unorthodox environments so my thinking is jaded by that. But, specifically to your clarification Hank, the articulated handle would be a good starting point to see what position you think you need then, you could mock up something from that point once you confirm the proof of design.
To Phil's and Chris's point- agree with regards to sharpening a saw blade the more important aspect it how you set up the saw and its relative position would be the part that requires the most attention. The filing part then becomes predictable and thereby, the sharpening becomes consistent across the blade.
Off topic a bit, I only hand sharpen my chainsaws and in order to do this in the woods, typically, I will make a cut in a log about 1/2 the bar width and then shut the saw off and tighten the chain up to stiffen, then use it as my hold, then sharpen. An average 30 inch chain take about 6-10 min to totally sharpen. On these saws I use a semi chisel full skip blade. The reason I brought this up is some of the other Timber Fallers add a small shaped block on the back of the handle of the file helps keep the file cutting pressure controllable across the length of the file. They say less hand fatigue, just another different take on a task.
 

Chris C

Chris
Senior User
Agreed that the filing angle can be an issue but can't a guide like this help with that problem...?

20210423_161126.jpg
 

Chris C

Chris
Senior User
Agreed. My first saw vise was one I copied from Tom Lie Nielson. I marked the angles on the top with a Sharpie. Worked like a charm. Then I picked up this Sargent vise and been using it ever since.

20210424_213415.jpg




Lot cheaper to mark angle on top of wooden blocks holding the saw. You don't have to mark every tooth.
 

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