Safety with Power - Elec Look at this !

Oka

Casey
Corporate Member
One of my Union Electricians wanted to be helpful to one of our clients. Currently we are modernizing 5000 homes on a couple of military bases. So when we swap out the Air Conditioning system , we provide temp cooling for that one night they are without A/C. We are under contract to provide one unit downstairs and one unit upstairs.

This Journeyman brought in 4 temp cooling units into this house and plugged them in to 1 circuit ........ each draws 13 amps.

4x13 = 52 amps on a 15 amp breaker. Because the breaker failed (Homeline brand go figure). 20 year old home.

LOOK AT THE PIXS ......... This is why I tell people to pay attention to electricity and the material they are using to run the power.

Homeline brand is not a decent product. Buy the QO or equal, especially if you plan on running higher demanding power through it.

Never use #14 wire for plug/outlets, only use #12 gauge. FYI 14-gauge is used for running max 13 amps with a max capacity of 18 amps provided the run in developed length of wire is 50 ft or less. As you can see, this just about started a fire in the home. Thank God the Worker turned them on all at once to see them run before leaving the site.
This is a perfect example of what can happen when not all things are checked in an older home.

Basic reasons for this:
  1. He did not check to see what circuit he was on and did not confirm what the capacity of the breaker was.
  2. He did not check to confirm the wiring gauge.
  3. Did not know what the run length is (this is hard to ascertain in an existing buried condition)
  4. Did think that running 52 amps of equipment was safe and ok at the home to operate.
  5. HE DID NOT DO HIS JOB OF "CHECK BEFORE PROCEEDING"
I posted this because, too many people really do not understand power/electricity/stored energy , etc. Ignorance is dangerous.

This is a poster child of what not to do. No common sense and not thinking of the consequence of this actions.

Bottom line, when making your shops more power and more breaker protection is the best insurance for decades of safe and good performing system. If that means updating your main panel .....DO IT.......... FYI 125 amp panel is about 75 bucks less than a 200 amp panel and the 2-0 wire for the feed is about 100-125.00 over #2 more.
 

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bowman

Board of Directors, Webmaster
Neal
Staff member
Corporate Member
He also needs to be banned from working at the military base.
 
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Oka

Casey
Corporate Member
I agree but I am just a manager, who used to be a licensed Engineering, General, Underground, Plumbing, Hvac, and Elec contractor ............ but what would do I know ? .......:rolleyes:

because people are busy labor groups are letting in a lot of people in who should not be doing this kind of work.

Wait.. A " Union Electrician" did this??

He needs his card pulled and sent back to school.
 
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Pop Golden

New User
Pop
I did the wiring in my shop. I used #14 wire on only 3 circuits. 2 are lighting (max. 8 or 9 amps. & my sanding machines all of which are under 5 amps. This is where #14 should go. All these breakers are 15 amp. The rest of the shop is #12 wire on 20 amp breakers. Remember that I am a one person shop no 2 of these machines are on at the same time.

Pop
 

junquecol

Bruce
Senior User
When I built our house (1980,) the only #14 anywhere in house was from overhead recessed lights to wall switch. Light fixture was fed using #12. Perfectly legal back then, but maybe not so today.
 

Oka

Casey
Corporate Member
That is typical to wire that way except for bathrooms with resistance heat.

Lights and switch legs are the only thing I wire in 14 ga. That way, after the walls are closed up you see 14 ga you know it is not line voltage, but switches or lights.


When I built our house (1980,) the only #14 anywhere in house was from overhead recessed lights to wall switch. Light fixture was fed using #12. Perfectly legal back then, but maybe not so today.
 

Pop Golden

New User
Pop
Folks! If you wire a switch to a 20 amp circuit that switch is on a 20 amp circuit. Using #14 to the switch is not a good idea. I wire my 20 amp switches with the same wire I use in the circuit I'm switching #12.

Pop
 

Oka

Casey
Corporate Member
Agreed if you are running the hot leg through the switch.

In the home though, most new homes are ALL 14 ga pretty crazy if you ask me.

Folks! If you wire a switch to a 20 amp circuit that switch is on a 20 amp circuit. Using #14 to the switch is not a good idea. I wire my 20 amp switches with the same wire I use in the circuit I'm switching #12.

Pop
 

junquecol

Bruce
Senior User
Folks! If you wire a switch to a 20 amp circuit that switch is on a 20 amp circuit. Using #14 to the switch is not a good idea. I wire my 20 amp switches with the same wire I use in the circuit I'm switching #12.

Pop
Look at fixture and see if it's rated for 20 amps. Very few lights are. Remember that you can use 15 amp recpts. on a 20 amp circuit. Pop, here is another one for you. How can I legally run 75 amps on #6 THHN, when tables show 60 amp max.
 

Oka

Casey
Corporate Member
Table rate THW, THWN, RHW rated @ 75c at 60amps. THHN, or other equally rated wire which is heat rated @ 90c is rated to a max of 75 amps .......... PROVIDED:
All connections from point of power supply to final connection is also rated @ 90c. This means the breaker, buss bar, wire nuts and connections to equipment and said equipment are all 90c rated, and the line length does not exceed 100 ft or 3 volts of voltage drop which ever comes1st. Technically, that is how the code reads

Most wire sold to homes is 90c or THHN, but not all downstream devices are 90c rated, you really have to check.

BTW, Here is an excellent link explaining wire loads, etc......... Worth Reading Check it out - Wire Sizing


Look at fixture and see if it's rated for 20 amps. Very few lights are. Remember that you can use 15 amp recpts. on a 20 amp circuit. Pop, here is another one for you. How can I legally run 75 amps on #6 THHN, when tables show 60 amp max.
 
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