Problem Removing Jointer Wedges

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larryn

New User
larry
Hi, I am having a problem replacing the blades on an older Craftsman 6 1/8" jointer. I purchased this jointer new around 1983 and have used it occasionally over the years. The model number is 113.206931 and the serial number is 4017.P0663 I never attempted to change the blades until recently and cannot get the wedges loose in order to remove the blades. I have tried WD40, PB Blaster, and a 50/50 solution of automatic transmission fluid and acetone that a friend of mine says works better than anything one can purchase for this purpose. I have worked on this for about a week now with no success at all. It is very hard to hit the wedges with a punch since the bearings are real close to the cutterhead, and there is hardly any room for prying. I have not tried to use any heat and I'm a bit reluctant to do so. I thought that perhaps I could knock the arbor out and then with the cutterhead removed from the jointer, I would be in a better position to deal with it. So, I came across this forum and thought that I may be able to receive some expert assistance and/or advice. I'm not sure how hard it will be to knock the arbor out but Sears does carry replacement bearings if I screw them up but there are no wedges or cutterheads available so I need to proceed with caution. I noticed that on the cutterhead there are two screws which appear perhaps to be set screws for the arbor but i'm not sure about that. I assume that the arbor can be removed with a punch and hammer? Not sure how else it could be done? I'm not terribly excited about removing the cutterhead just to replace blades but not sure what else I can try in order to loosen up the parts. For the time being I can put the screws back in (they all did come loose) and sharpen the blades a bit with a stone. Thanks for any advice. larryn
 

Mark Gottesman

New User
Mark
I have not worked on one of these type jointers, but these techniques should yield results. I would also wait till a couple more of the jointer gurus check in. You might also want to check out http://owwm.org . If the blades have never been removed or reset there is a high probability they are frozen in with a combination of rust and pitch.

The ATF/acetone mix is usually a good one. If you feel the need to try another product, there is one called Kroil or Marvel Mystery Oil. Highly favored in many rebuild shops.

Replacing the bearings might not be a bad idea after 27 years. I'm not sure of the shelf life on the grease. Looking at the PDF of the manual, it does not look to be an overly complicated job. but, you want to avoid that and I have spent weeks on jobs that were not overly complicated.:help: it would make blade changing a bit easier. If you do not have a manual, let me know and I will send a copy.


So, maybe try the following, you may be able to use the lift screws [part #57 in the manual located below the blades] to put bottom tension on the blades to push them out. BEWARE THAT YOU COULD STRIP OUT THESE SCREWS IF YOU HAVE TOO HEAVY A HAND. Maybe combine a gentle push from the bottom along with a slight bit of heat from a hair dryer or a french fry light to get it just hot to the touch. Do this after a few more days of solvent and gentle tapping with a drift [The Cast iron bearing caps will limit how much of a hammering you can deliver]. Once it pops, you will be home free. Just going to take some time.

After looking at the diagram a bit more maybe this would work to break things loose. Run the lift screws into the cutter head so the blades are unsupported. Put a block of wood across the blade and tap it to move the blade down into the recess. I thing if you get the blade moving up and down it might be enough to unstick things. You could move the blade back up with the lift screws.

You could also try making a tool that would have a z configuration. One finger would point down and hook over the blade and wedge and the other end would stick up so you strike it. Sort of like the pull bar they use when working or snap in floors.
 
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larryn

New User
larry
Mark, Thanks for your suggestions. I will follow up on the other woodworking site also. I do have the original owners manual if that is the one you are referring to? I certainly appreciate your help and I'll see what other members have to say. larryn
 

cptully

New User
Chris
Larry,

If they knives are truly frozen and you do resort to heat, you may want to consider a hot/cold combo:

Ice pack on the cutter head (for a while to get the whole assembly cold) and heat applied to the blade (only). The idea here is differential heating. As the blade heats up the slight discontinuity between it and the body of the cutter head should cause the two pieces to expand at different rates, and ideally popping the frozen joint loose.

Assuming that you are ready to install new blades and discard the 27 year old blades a few gentle taps on the cutting edge of the blade should pop it loose. Try tapping both down (parallel to the stuck surface) and sideways (perpendicular to the stuck surface).

I have almost exactly the same jointer as you (have not checked the part number but the age is about right), but have not yet had to change the blades - I bought it used with a nice new set of blades already installed.

Let us know what finally works!

Chris Tully
 

Sully

New User
jay
Have you loosened the screws that hold the wedges/knives in place? Often times they have to be tightened in order to loosen the tension on the wedge. I'm not familiar with this specific model jointer but just speaking in general.

J
 

larryn

New User
larry
Once again. Thanks to everyone and your very helpful suggestions. I have attacked the problem a couple more times without success so I plan to put the screws back in and attempt to sharpen the blades a bit with a stone, finish my project and then go at it again with a bit more vigor. I don't want to start hitting on the blades right now and then be stuck with not being able to use the jointer at all. I am going to consider knocking out the arbor and dealing with the cutterhead off of the machine which will be only other alternative if I can't loosen things up in place, although my prior experience with arbors and bearings tells me that I could have problems knocking the arbor out considering how frozen everything else seems to be. I placed the initial posting on three different forums. (Woodworking Talk; Old Woodworking Machines; and North Carolina Woodworker). I am very impressed with everyone on all forums and I appreciate your interest in my problem and your suggestions. I will let you all know how things turn out and for what its worth, attached is a picture of the cutterhead. Any furtherr words of wisdom will certainly be appreciated. larry

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junquecol

Bruce
Senior User
Larry, the other day I was looking at one of the early issues of ShopNotes, and they had an article on changing jointer knives. The illustrations match the machine that you have. The adjusting screws under the blades will lift the blade vertically, possibly freeing the wedges, if the wedge bolts are loosened first. You might be able to get a cotter pin puller under the wedges also, without removing the cutter head.
 

Brockmania

New User
Will
My father-in-law is a mechanic from upstate NY and has tried everything you could imagine to get unbolt old and rusty screws. He recommended fluid-film to me for a similar situation, just spray it on and let it do it's magic for a day. He swears by it and as you could imagine a mechanic from upstate NY has seen all kinds of rusty bolts. The best way I can describe it is a waxy WD40. But here's the website if you'd like to check it out. http://www.fluid-film.com/ Good luck.
 

Gofor

Mark
Corporate Member
I would surmise from the description and pictures that the cutters are glued in by one or both of two things: old resin and rust.

My first step would be to try mineral spirits to soften the natural wood resin. Soak, let set overnight, and tap with a mallet and hardwood block against the cutter to see if it loosens. This will soften most natural resin.

Second would be to use penetrating fluid to break loosen the rust component: Everyone has their favorite, be it WD-40, Break-Free, Brake cleaner, Brake fluid, Jet engine oil, Miracle Oil, etc. In my experience, all work about equally well on most stuck parts, but Break-Free has worked best on heavily rusted items. Again, hardwood block against cutter and mallet after soaking.

The key is patience to let it work and multiple applications. If you have a rivet gun or something that can give a vibration pressure to it, that will speed things up considerably. A mallet struck multiple times against a hardwood block may be all that's needed.

If you have ever tried to take apart an automobile alternator, you may be able to relate: If you use an impact gun and socket at low pressure, you can back the shaft nut off by holding the cooling fan just wrapped with a shop towel, If you try to remove that same nut with a breaker bar and socket, you cannot hold it tight enough with your hand, and will invariably damage the fan cooling fins by the time you get enough torque to break it loose. Vibration is the key.

JMTCW

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