Kitchen island: design ideas

[eyekode]

We are planning on bumping out the back of our house adding ~5 feet to our kitchen and creating a new office. This will give us room to add a larger island and hopefully a coffee bar. I plan on making the new island and coffee bar. The rest I will leave up to contractors.

Hopefully you guys can help me settle on some of the details .

Here is my floorplan:

We will have room for a pretty good size island. And my wife wants seating on one side.

My cabinets are maple and we plan on sticking with that. But the island will be an accent so I have some liberty. I found this on the web and really like the general aesthetics:
https://www.retroitalia.net/remarka...y-slab-cabinet-doors-from-natural-maple-wood/

Like the above link the carcass will be walnut and the top will be laminated/strip maple. Not sure how to finish it. We will not cut on the surface.

We also need to relocate our microwave so I plan on using a drawer-style and building it into the island.

Here is an image of the basic design:

There is only a foot overhang for seating but I think that will be sufficient?

The top three drawers will be continuous grain like this:

I am not 100% sure how I will do the drawer under the microwave. But I am thinking it will have a single wide board and use an under-mount drawer slide?

I am also not sure how I will do the legs/frame yet. As drawn they are 4" thick. I doubt I can source 4" thick walnut (although it looks like the hardwood store has it in their price book ...). I have seen 4 piece and 5 piece leg designs. But I am not sure how much I care about making these look like one solid piece of wood. I actually like the laminated look on my workbench:

I am also not sure on the edge treatment for the legs. I know a sharp 90 doesn't hold up well and is no fun to run into. But am leaning toward just easing the edges.

Anyway I am rambling on. I really need to make it back to one of the monthly lunches to bounce ideas off of fellow WW'ers live .

It is good to be back in the shop!
Salem

 

[Dave Richards]

It looks like a nice start to your island design. I designed one late last year for a friend who was building his wife's dream kitchen. They went with a drawer-type microwave, too but we put it on the right side instead of the middle.

Are you planning flush panels or will the be recessed a little? I'm not sure about the asymmetric panel widths on the ends and would likely get rid of the leg in the middle.

I'd make the bottom rails in the knee recess the same width as those on the sides.

As for the corners of the legs, I think stopped chamfers would be a good option. Stop them at the rails.

 

[Berta]

I agree that the ends should be centered.

 

[zdorsch]

I would go with at least 18” overhang—that was a good overhand length at my family house.

I like the different species of wood for your workbench, but question it in a kitchen. I would try and grain match two pieces of 8/4 if you can’t find 16/4.

I’m curios if you will be able to put a decent sized drawer under the microwave. Do the drawer microwaves hang like a wall mount microwave or do they need to sit on a shelf?

I like your idea of just smoothing the edges instead of making some type of profile, but that may depend on the other cabinets in the kitchen.

 

[eyekode]

It looks like a nice start to your island design. I designed one late last year for a friend who was building his wife's dream kitchen. They went with a drawer-type microwave, too but we put it on the right side instead of the middle.

Are you planning flush panels or will the be recessed a little? I'm not sure about the asymmetric panel widths on the ends and would likely get rid of the leg in the middle.

I'd make the bottom rails in the knee recess the same width as those on the sides.

As for the corners of the legs, I think stopped chamfers would be a good option. Stop them at the rails.

Dave,
Thanks for the feedback!
Putting the microwave on the side is interesting. With the overhang I have it would then be offset on the side. That may look odd too. But it would be nice in that it would only interfere with dishwasher instead of the stove.

I am planning recessed panels. Shaker style. The reason the panels are asymmetric on the sides is structural. The middle post lines up with the back of the cabinet that is recessed under the counter top. But if I go with the drawn two legs under the recess I probably don't need to line up the outside legs. I will think on it.

As for the bottom rails in the recess they are supposed to be the same size. It is an error in my drawing. I forgot to update all the sides of the model when I reduced the rail size. Thanks for the catch!
Salem

 

[eyekode]

I would go with at least 18” overhang—that was a good overhand length at my family house.

I like the different species of wood for your workbench, but question it in a kitchen. I would try and grain match two pieces of 8/4 if you can’t find 16/4.

I’m curios if you will be able to put a decent sized drawer under the microwave. Do the drawer microwaves hang like a wall mount microwave or do they need to sit on a shelf?

I like your idea of just smoothing the edges instead of making some type of profile, but that may depend on the other cabinets in the kitchen.

Thanks for the info on the overhang. I couldn't find any great reference on the web.

As for the difference species on my bench: I didn't mean I would mix on the island. I just meant it may not look bad to be laminated.

It looks like there is only one real manufacturer of drawer-style microwaves: Sharp. I read the install instructions and they require "a shelf that can hold minimum 100lbs".

The drawer face under the microwave is ~23x8.5. I think that is a useful size although a little shallow for a "big" drawer.
Salem

 

[Dave Richards]

I only meant the microwave was to the right instead of centered on the long side.

I think the middle posts are overkill from a structural point of view.

d

 

[eyekode]

Thanks Dave,
I get it now . I prefer the aesthetics of a centered microwave. Why did you offset it? For more drawers?

I tend to overbuild. As drawn the table top is 2" thick. That is going to be a significant slab! But I am reconsidering. I can probably get away with all the "interior" legs as ~2" thick (but still 4" wide). But I still need that many legs to keep the panel size reasonable. I will re-draw with symmetrical end panels an see how it works.

Salem

 

[Dave Richards]

The lady of the kitchen wanted it closer to the range which was to the right when standing on the business side of the island. It made it possible to make a wider lower cabinet to the left with double doors, too.

 

[Jeff]

Interesting design discussion. How about removing that center leg and the narrow panel next to it? It seems to open it up a bit and it isn't so busy. Our kitchen island overhang is 12" deep without corner posts for support. Bar stool type seating is pretty comfortable and we're 6' tall.

https://www.houzz.com/photo/13216548-woodview-contemporary-kitchen-austin

http://videos.osbornewood.com/beautiful-kitchen-island-features-belleville-island-posts

https://www.decorpad.com/photo.htm?photoId=127548

 

[Travis Porter]

The drawer under your microwave is comparable to the drawer I put under our double oven. It is around 9 3/4 inches and one solid board with under mount slides. I think your plan for it makes sense.

 

[SteveHall]

I like the laminated leg look, too. Are you going to build it like a workbench with infill panels?! That could look fantastic! (For a select audience, 99% who are NCWWs--more table than casework but equally useful.)

It's hard to tell, maybe there's <36" in front of the fridge and along the island? I'd recommend 48" clear unless you're a discerning chef who likes minimal easy-reach turn-around clearance without any "help" in the kitchen--then down to 36" (even 32"). But for accessibility or group/family cooking events, this might need from 60" to 96" to get people by each other with cookware, steaming pots, or working at stations back-to-back.

12" deep kneespace under the bar is fine for casual food/drinks or kids. 16"-18" is needed for longer meals. But the hard question is height. Usually counter height is 36". As a casual bar it requires slightly higher chairs than normal, like a short stool. But "real" bars are 42" high so those standing and seated on a stool are the same eye level. And then more comfortable seating is too low for counter height, only 29"-30" high. So split bar or single height? Choices.

 

[eyekode]

Steve,
Yes it will be framed more like a table then typical cabinetry. Our current island is a tiny little thing but it still ends up being a focal point so I think it deserves to be more like furniture then your typical kitchen cabinet.

Yes there is only 28" between the fridge and the edge of the island as drawn. Today we only have 22" and it feels cramped at times. I was hoping the extra 6" would help. The trade off for more space is a shorter island. And a large island is 1/2 of reason we want a larger kitchen (my wife's 1/2 ).

There is 32" between the stove and the kitchen. I am hesitant to pull the island out further to make room because there is a breakfast table on the other side. And I would have to steal space from the walkway between the breakfast area and kitchen to make more room between the island and the stove. That walkway is really heavily traveled and we don't want to have to walk around the island to get to the back door.

This ~5' extension of the back wall takes us to our rear lot setback so unfortunately I cannot go further. We did discuss using all the space for a kitchen but decided to keep the breakfast area.

As for the bar area I considered a raised bar on the back of the island but my wife is 5' tall so "typical" bar height is not comfortable. It may be a challenge to find the right stools but I enjoyed my last stool project:

Thanks for all the ideas and comments! This is a big project for me and I really want to get it right .

 

[eyekode]

Jeff,
My initial drawing was with open legs. But I thought it felt odd because the top has radius'd ends. I did this on my breakfast nook table and I really like the effect:

I redid the sketch with an open leg:

I think this could look good if there was more overhang. Or if the top didn't have a radius.

I also tried a sketch with the top drawer "level" extended to the leg:

I think this one looks a little better. But I think I prefer the closed side. I am sketching up a version with symmetrical side panels now as more than one person has commented on it.

 

[eyekode]

Quite a few people have commented that the asymmetric side panels were not the best. Here are some alternatives:

Single Panel:

Split Panel:

Both of these options leave me with an odd joint under the overhang:

I guess I could use pocket hole screws (on the back side of course) to hold these members together. But I don't like that this joint would support one of the corners of the cabinet. I know my wife will put a kitchen-aid mixer right there .

Thanks again for all the discussion!

 

[SteveHall]

Yes it will be framed more like a table then typical cabinetry. Our current island is a tiny little thing but it still ends up being a focal point so I think it deserves to be more like furniture then your typical kitchen cabinet.

That should be great! Please post pictures. I'm always looking for precedent of great residential ideas and craftsmanship examples.

There is 32" between the stove and the kitchen. I am hesitant to pull the island out further to make room because there is a breakfast table on the other side.

I say do what you like. The beauty of designing and building it yourself is that you can customize so that it really fits you. I think most others see custom design and wish they had the same. But some real estate people get worried about <48" in a kitchen and feel like there are major problems at 36". You know, the "re-sale" worry. But then there are some very famous chefs who insist on 32" in the kitchen because it is so easy to use both sides standing in one spot. You have to make sure the cabinet doors all work and the dishwasher and refrigerator spots can manage a 36" swing unless you go French door and drawer style, like you are.

As for the bar area I considered a raised bar on the back of the island but my wife is 5' tall so "typical" bar height is not comfortable. It may be a challenge to find the right stools but I enjoyed my last stool project:

Should work well, again you can customize to preference. I've always wanted a big 3-4" wood thread maker so I could make adjustable height stools. I used some when I was young and always thought it was a good way for everyone to get exactly what they needed at a bar.

Please keep us posted with photos!

 

[eyekode]

Good points on the resale Steve. I had no idea < 48" was bad. Every dimension is getting larger than we have today!

 

[Jeff]

I'm on the fence here and lots of good points have been raised so I'm returning to square one.

1. What's the intended function of the new island besides a larger focal point in the kitchen and "We can design and build this for a small area because we want to"?

2. Build it like the current one but just larger and keep the existing breakfast table area? Delete that breakfast table area and use the new counter with the overhang and seating for breakfast, dinner, and buffet dinner entertaining?

3.

We are planning on bumping out the back of our house adding ~5 feet to our kitchen and creating a new office.

I can't tell which direction from your drawing pic #1. Left to right I guess but I don't see a 5' (60" addition).

4. My blunt opinion: I still think that the new designs looks chunky, broken up, and too busy, particularly for a small space. That's just me but you asked.........

 

[eyekode]

I probably wasn't clear about what is changing. Here is an image of our old space vs new. New is on the left:

The goal of pushing out the back wall (right kitchen wall in the image above) 5' is to make the kitchen a little larger so we can fit a larger island (my wife's request). She would like to be able to pull a few stools up to it. And we also want a small coffee prep/extra sink area which you can see in the above drawing as an extra cabinet along the right wall.

Honestly it doesn't fell that cramped to me today. But it is nice to hear other opinions as it is true we may not live here forever. Although we have been here for 17 years.

 

[Skymaster]

Unless there is a setback issue i would strongly suggest larger than 5 ft. That dimension has HUGE waste factor for material.
The other point once finished in 5 ft is gonna feel and look more like 3.IF possible go 8. You at 5 have already bought 8' material and cut off 3 which doesn't do anything of merit in construction.All sheet goods normally used in construction are nominal 4 x 8. Changes on labor and footings etc are minuscule,materials basically zero.