Joinery Opinions

[Canuck]

There appears to be a vast degree of expertise here and I (as a novice) am interested in knowing what the overall joinery preferences are - Dowels, mortise and tenon, biscuit's,pocket holes etc.. I know that it would depend on the application, but I have been using dowels (w/DowelMax Jig) with quite a bit of success, but was wondering if I am limiting myself to one particular type of joinery.

I realize that each have their own merits, but was wonering what the you experienced WW's recommend.

Thanks in Advance,

Wayne

 

[Monty]

Like you said, it depends... what you're used to, your skill level, what tools you have, what your particular project needs, esthetic considerations, and probably several other factors.

Strength is an important factor, of course ... there was a recent WW mag that did a strength test of various joint types, by dropping heavy weights on them. Not very scientific, but it looked like fun! Anyway, who can remember the magazine/issue?

 

[Ozzie-x]

Ditto Insom. I don't have a clue about the strength test article, but would be interesting to see the results. Years ago I used lots of dowels, mainly because I had a drill (and a TS). A lot of the joinery also depends on the style of furniture you're building, especially any exposed joinery. Certain styles require specific joinery to keep in step with the particular style. Concealed joinery doesn't matter as much as long as it's strong and durable. Like Insom said, a lot of it is governed by what tools you have also. I use a majority of mortise & tenon joinery, maybe because everything I build at least has an Arts & Crafts/Mission influence. :saw:

 

[DaveO]

I have used bisciut jointery with great success. That article that Insom. is refering to placed bisciuts just beneith loose tenon and mortise and intergal T&M. I built a table that is [ shaped to fit under and over a couch. My 30lb. 2 yr. old has been jumping on it without any failure. It was constructed with double biscuits.
I have just ventured into M&T joints and dowled joints. You need a good jig for dowels, I tried using centers and was off just a hair on about 1/2 of them. True M&T can be a little more forgiving, i.e adjusting the tenon to fit the mortise. I think the newest method is gonna be loose tenons, easier to do with a router, and less hand chiseling. My .02, Dave

 

[D L Ames]

Like you said, it depends... what you're used to, your skill level, what tools you have, what your particular project needs, esthetic considerations, and probably several other factors.

Strength is an important factor, of course ... there was a recent WW mag that did a strength test of various joint types, by dropping heavy weights on them. Not very scientific, but it looked like fun! Anyway, who can remember the magazine/issue?

Insom, I believe Wood Magazine was the one that conducted that test. I'll see if I can find the article you mention. Your right........it did look like fun.

D L

 

[McRabbet]

I've used mortise and tenon joints for joining table legs to the rails, including mitered tenons meeting at right angles to form a rock solid joint; I prefer biscuits for joining jointed boards for panels and pocket screws for mounting face frames and table tops to supporting rails. I've only used dowels for repair of existing doweled work. For rails and stile connections, my strongest joints have been haunched mortise and tenons -- they take patience, but I think they are stronger than stick and cope joints done with a router or shaper. Of course the classic -- and probably the strongest -- joint of all is the dovetail.

Rob

Side note for Mike Davis -- And triple bumped 16d nails from my framing gun hold tar paper down real good when you get to that stage! :roll:

 

[Mark Fogleman]

Festool is introdicing a new tool in Germany called the Domino. Won't be released here for a while(year+). It is essentially a floating tenon machine using tenons the shape of a domino w/rounded edges of different sizes.
Here is a translated version of the intro on the German Festool webpage:

http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=de_en&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.festool.de%2Fartikel%2Fartikel_weiterleiten.cfm%3Fid%3D5146%26CFID%3D2025937%26CFTOKEN%3De3e5d13fe72ee5af-CCF42C78-A4FD-E0F8-78D44BE2F3B1BC0A

Mark

 

[woodguy1975]

The article was in wood probably 5-6 issues ago. If I remember a dowel joint wasn't too far behind the traditional tenon and a loose tenon. The tradional and loose tenon were very close in strength.

For jointery to me it just depends on the project. Joining legs to an apron - mortise and tenon.... Complex angled joints - dowel.... Solid wood case work - dovetails...

Good Luck,

John

 

[Canuck]

Thanks a lot guys for all of the input. I guess I was trying to justify the $265.00 I spent on the DowelMax jig. (It sure is easy to use and I get great results with either edge joining or rails/stiles to legs.) The dowelled joint seems to be pretty strong.

Someday I may want to try loose tennons. (At least until I can become proficient with cutting a mortise with an old fashioned chisel!)

Thanks Again!

Wayne

 

[Steve D]

I have a friend who is a world renowned Luthier (violin maker). A very famous concert master who happened to be rather tight cheeked (being PC nice) dropped off a rather expensive piece to be repaired. My friend did the required work and then got to thinking how this nose-in-the-air would react to a glaring mistake. But he was thinking it had to be a magnificent mistake. So, he sawed the head off a 3/4 inch hex head bolt and used a little wax to hold it to the fingerboard of this Strad box. When the guy came to pick it up he handed him the closed case and said "It won't be coming loose now!"

Smelling salts were required when the case was opened!

[/quote]

:rolf:

 

[McRabbet]

I hope my dry humor didn't vex you.

I knew the rest of the guys would cover Mortice & Tenon, Dovetail, Box, Sliding Dovetail, Loose Tenon, Inverted T Slot and Spline joints. Do we always have to be totally correct and serious? You can't stand an obvious joke?

Ya'll have fun sometime.

Believe me, I was just trying to add some humor to your great quip!! And I loved your story about the violin case and agreed with Steve's :rolf: !

BTW -- if you've seen some of my other posts, I inject my fair share of humor where possible! And, your 20d nail work on your shop building is looking great -- true dedication! Your should be proud of your accomplishment (and having the only slow-mo video avatar on the forum!)

Rob

 

[mshel]

Thanks a lot guys for all of the input. I guess I was trying to justify the $265.00 I spent on the DowelMax jig. (It sure is easy to use and I get great results with either edge joining or rails/stiles to legs.) The doweled joint seems to be pretty strong.

Someday I may want to try loose tenons. (At least until I can become proficient with cutting a mortise with an old fashioned chisel!)

Thanks Again!

Wayne

Wayne,

I use the following for different applications / situations:

Stanley #59 dowel jig - repairing antiques and such
Bead-lock loose tenon jig - Used in conjunction with stick & cope doors
Standard mortise & tenon joinery - New construction and repairs when necessary.

I would think that you could use the dowel max to drill sequential holes and create a loose tenon joint. You can make your own loose tenons with a router / router table and a round over bit. That is if you have a desire to give it a try. For me, given my situation, I have to be flexible and be able to make / apply different techniques to each project / repair I do. When restoring / repairing a piece of furniture, I fix the problem making the joint just like it was originally whether it be dowel or mortise & tenon. When building a custom piece, I use whatever joinery that goes with the particular piece I am making. By that I mean, if I am making a reproduction 18th century piece, I am going to use mortise & tenon, dovetails, and such. If I am commissioned to make a contemporary piece, then I will use the type of joinery that will make the piece as strong as possible because I warranty all my furniture for my lifetime. After that, there will be a small charge. :mrgreen: Well I have rambled on enough. Just my 2 Abe's.

Mike

 

[DavidF]

Mostly loose tenon when the need for that type of join comes up