Great Write Up on PS, RS, and QS in oak frames and panels

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NCTurner

Gary
Corporate Member
Author: Tom Sontag

Paying attention to grain patterns with ring porous hardwoods like oak and ash is an important step in a woodworker's maturation adn a big part pf whether a design succeeds or not. I still have a piece or two I made before I discovered this and frankly, they are hard to look at now. Even though I have since learned to pay attention, I have never seen a systematic review of what different effects were available. So I made three oak frames and three oak panels, stained them to highlight the grain a bit, and interchanged them based upon the grain patterning of how the board was cut from the log. There are nine different combinations. (I was not too exacting with my finishing).

To review, below you see the three frames, with the quartersawn (QS) one at bottom with its annual rings running vertically in the picture and the medullary rays, which radiate from the pith outward, being horizontal. Where the ray surfaces on the face of the board is what yields the showy figure. In the middle is the riftsawn (RS frame, with both rings and rays on diagonals. The plainsawn (PS) frame on top is more like most boards you buy when you buy oak showing the prominent grain patterning of the annual rings on its face.

IMG_7733.jpg


Here are the three combinations all using the PS frame with PS panel first, RS panel next, and the QS panel third:

IMG_7734.jpg
IMG_7735.jpg
IMG_7736.jpg


In my opinion, none of these are particularly satisfying combinations because the wild uncontrolled grain of the frame is so distracting. And since PS is what you usually get when you buy without paying close attention, this is reason number one to think these things through when you design and when you select boards for a project.

Next, the RS frame with PS, RS and QS panels:

IMG_7737.jpg
IMG_7738.jpg
IMG_7739.jpg


Notice how the frame receeds and lets the panel be the focus? If you are going to use a ring porous wood, I'd almost always default to the RS frame for this reason. Note how quiet and unobtrusive the RS/RS one is? I like the effect but it could be considered almost too quiet; the action of the other two panels can be used to quite good effect, keeping in mind what happens with the other parts of the project that aren't frame and panel construction.

Next, the QS frame with PS, RS and QS panels:

IMG_7740.jpg
IMG_7741.jpg
IMG_7742.jpg


These aren't subtle, huh? Yet i could imagine finding a way to make the last two work. The PS panel is just an outta control visual, like watching a group of leopards go at it with a family of tigers. The RS panel might be a way to calm down a piece with lots of QS material. Most ww'ers seem to like the boisterous use QS with QS; a few craftsman era pieces depend on it.

Anyhow, draw your own conclusions. I've sprinkled mine in here and they are only my opinions. What do you think?
Author: Tom Sontag
 
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Bill Clemmons

Bill
Corporate Member
Gary: thank you for a great thread. For me, this really emphasizes the "educational" nature of NCWoodworker. Personally, I like the RS/RS combination because of it's muted subtly. But as you pointed out, it would depend on the type of piece you were building and what surrounded it. My favorite style is Shaker, and they were definitely not flashy.

Like you, I've got some old pieces in the house I was quite proud of at the time, but now I'm a little embarrassed by my lack of attention to grain selection. Live and learn!

Thanks again for this review. :icon_thum

Bill
 

merrill77

Master Scrap Maker
Chris
Anyhow, draw your own conclusions. I've sprinkled mine in here and they are only my opinions. What do you think?

Good timing. I'm in the beginning stages of a good-sized project with white oak. The design takes inspiration primarily from craftsman & mission styles - primarily straight lines, frame-and-panel doors and drawers with flat panels. In a previous project, I did much better with wood selection on some of the primary pieces, but left many parts to chance - and the results show it. This time, I'm attempting to greatly improve my wood selection...to the point of selecting and tracking every part that is visible from the front or sides through the entire construction process. It's already a chore and I've barely started.

Anyway, in the spring I picked up a FWW special-issue on furniture design that illustrated some of these same points. I've come to the same conclusions as you. I will need to make another trip to the wood store because I bought QS white oak and now I have too much of the strong QS figure and not enough of the RS figure. I want all the rails and stiles of the doors and drawer panels to be RS, as well as the drawer dividers and the corner posts. I will use the pieces with a strong QS figure only for the drawer/door panels and the top. I'm also planning to bookmatch all the door/drawer panels...further complicating things. Should be interesting...

C
 

NCTurner

Gary
Corporate Member
Thanks guys, but I found the info elsewhere. Author: Tom Sontag I just thought I would share as it is a well written article and great photo study.
 
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Alan in Little Washington

Alan Schaffter
Corporate Member
As many of you know, I built my shop cabinets, doors, and trim from white oak harvested when they cleared my lot. Since the logs were not especially big and quartering would not yield boards of decent width, I had the sawyer just slab everything. As expected I ended up with a mix of PS, RS, and QS white oak boards.

After seeing the result of using mixed boards to build my cabinets, I decided never to mix PS with RS or QS again, and I have become somewhat of a RS/QS snob- I no longer like anything made with PS oak. I think RS and QS go quite well together.

What is wrong with this pic of door and trim detail?

Trim-21.JPG


The PS top rail of the door sticks out like a sore thumb.

The cabinet doors and face frame are all made from RS and QS oak.

SinkUpper-4.jpg
 

CaptnA

Andy
Corporate Member
Thanks for posting Gary
this is definately a keeper article!
a picture is worth 1000 words so these comparison pics are worth.... well a lot~
 

Bill Clemmons

Bill
Corporate Member
Thanks guys, but I found the info elsewhere. Author: Tom Sontag I just thought I would share as it is a well written article and great photo study.

Did you find that article on-line? If so, is there a link to it? I'd like to save it for future reference. If not, I'll just cut and paste it into Word and save it that way.

Thanks again.

Bill
 

NCTurner

Gary
Corporate Member
Bill why not just save the link to this page? If you would really like the original link please PM me.
 

CrealBilly

New User
Jeff
I prefer Rift or Quarter Sawn with any wood species. I guess I'm with Alan and have become a QS/RS Snob. I just don't like (Flat/Plain sawn) cathedral grain anymore, don't like the looks of it or how it behaves. I was at the BORG today and passed by the oak lumber, Flat/Plain Sawn Red Oak is now $8.00 a board foot. I ABOUT HAD A COW, when I seen the prices DANG!!!

Great write up Gary - thanks
 

scsmith42

New User
Scott Smith
I was at the BORG today and passed by the oak lumber, Flat/Plain Sawn Red Oak is now $8.00 a board foot. I ABOUT HAD A COW, when I seen the prices DANG!!!

Great write up Gary - thanks

Ditto the thanks to Gary for taking the time to include this great info.

On a separate note... please pardon my "shameless commerce" post....

For NCWW members only, I have plenty of RS and QSRO in stock for a fraction of the BORG prices (not as much WO but there is some coming out of the kiln in a few weeks).

Your NCWW discounted price is also about 1/3 less than what you'll pay at the local wood dealers, and I can always use the farm income! You don't have to buy much wood before the savings will pay for your trip! Please send me a PM. Thanks! Scott
 

mlp2147

New User
Mike
Gary,
Thank you for your write-up. This type of info is extremely useful for a new guy like myself.

Mike
 
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