Finishing very old hard pine still laden with turpentine

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sgtdave

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Dave
I am working on a project for a friend, building a rotating bookcase to go next to a chair using some very old pine from an old family building. THese were beefy 4/4 boards or thicker reduced to 3/4". When planed, this wood gives off a very strong pine scent and much of it even feels slightly wet to the touch. The smell transfer to my hands and clothes. It has a rather dark rich patina. My friend wants it finished with something like a cherry stain (I would probably us Cherry gel stain). Can anyone give me guidance about proceeding to stain this. Does it need to dry or cure some before saining? Will the stain dry properly. How soon can I put a top coat on it?

Help appreciated.
 

CrealBilly

New User
Jeff
I am working on a project for a friend, building a rotating bookcase to go next to a chair using some very old pine from an old family building. THese were beefy 4/4 boards or thicker reduced to 3/4". When planed, this wood gives off a very strong pine scent and much of it even feels slightly wet to the touch. The smell transfer to my hands and clothes. It has a rather dark rich patina. My friend wants it finished with something like a cherry stain (I would probably us Cherry gel stain). Can anyone give me guidance about proceeding to stain this. Does it need to dry or cure some before saining? Will the stain dry properly. How soon can I put a top coat on it?

Help appreciated.
I probably would have dried, bug killed and set the pitch in my make shift kiln before joining, planing, sawing, routing...

I don't recall the temperature for heartwood pine that the lumber core needs to be brought up to and maintained or for how long though. Now that your in it this far... I don't have a clue on any advise to give you since you said the wood is still wet. Maybe some other member can give you some advise here?
 

sgtdave

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Dave
Thanks for ypur i put. Roblem is, this wpod is like a hundred years old and it was weathered and you couldn't tell much about it. It is very hard. I mean, make your plane complain hard. Only some pieces appear wet.

so now that I have what i got, Air dry. For some time? Any thoughts.


I probably would have dried, bug killed and set the pitch in my make shift kiln before joining, planing, sawing, routing...

I don't recall the temperature for heartwood pine that the lumber core needs to be brought up to and maintained or for how long though. Now that your in it this far... I don't have a clue on any advise to give you since you said the wood is still wet. Maybe some other member can give you some advise here?
 

Bill Clemmons

Bill
Corporate Member
Since it has already been planed, I would "sticker" it inside my shop for at least a couple of weeks. If it still feels wet after that, I doubt if it is moisture in the wood. More likely it is resin.

Take a sample from the "wettest" piece and apply the gel stain. Let it sit for a day and see how it feels. If dry to the touch, I'd go ahead w/ my finishing.
 

Jeff

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Jeff
this wpod is like a hundred years old and it was weathered and you couldn't tell much about it.

It's probably dry as far as water, but a "wet" feeling after planing is probably turpentine/resin on your hands and that could feel kind of sticky or tacky and it'll have a characteristic pine smell.

Seal a few scrap pieces with 100% dewaxed shellac like Zinnser SealCoat. Then use your cherry stain and see how it behaves. Carry on from there.
 

CrealBilly

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Jeff
It's probably dry as far as water, but a "wet" feeling after planing is probably turpentine/resin on your hands and that could feel kind of sticky or tacky and it'll have a characteristic pine smell.

Seal a few scrap pieces with 100% dewaxed shellac like Zinnser SealCoat. Then use your cherry stain and see how it behaves. Carry on from there.
The little experience I have with old heartwood pine tells me when the pitch is set it actually forms little balls on the surface that dry out and can be scraped away then sanded like hardwood.
 
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scsmith42

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Scott Smith
Pine pitch has a "memory" and will usually harden at 15 degrees less than the highest temperature that it has been exposed to. Typically the pitch is set in pine at the end of a kiln run at 160F or higher.

Dave, it sounds as if your boards were milled from a longleaf or slash pine tree. Sometimes SYP can be a real bear to accept a stain. You will most likely have the best results if you don't stain it. As Jeff recommended, an initial coat of shellac should work well.
 

Touchwood

New User
Don
+3 on the above...I would not try to stain it. I built a piece out of post oak for a friend and used tung-oil to finish it but it wasn't weeping sap if that's what you have.
Heart pine is really attractive when finished..maybe you should let your friend see the wood..he might like it as is.:)
 

sgtdave

New User
Dave
He's coming over Wednesday to look at where I am . I think he might be open to that suggestion; however, he may balk at that depending on the room decor and furniture where he wants to place it.

Thanks for your help. I am gthering all of the input I am getting from everyone here. A lot of what I am reading fortifies my own observations.

+3 on the above...I would not try to stain it. I built a piece out of post oak for a friend and used tung-oil to finish it but it wasn't weeping sap if that's what you have.
Heart pine is really attractive when finished..maybe you should let your friend see the wood..he might like it as is.:)
 

sgtdave

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Dave
I have used tung oil on some other woods and really like the outcome. Looks really good on zebrawood too.
 

sgtdave

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Dave
Thanks for your sugestions. You are correct on resins. Not moisture. It smells very strongly pine.
Never tried Zinser Sealcoat. If it is a shellac, it should dry rather quickly, right? Do I need to air dry first. Others thought stickering and drying it a couple of weeks in the shop might help too,
 

sgtdave

New User
Dave
Thanks. I am looking into the shellac. I've had my troubles with blotchy stains on certain wooods in the past and want to avoid messing up some very nice looking wood. I have cut 4 of the five 24" rounds that make the different shelf layers and the wood is really great looking,
 

Jeff

New User
Jeff
Thanks for your sugestions. You are correct on resins. Not moisture. It smells very strongly pine.
Never tried Zinser Sealcoat. If it is a shellac, it should dry rather quickly, right? Do I need to air dry first. Others thought stickering and drying it a couple of weeks in the shop might help too,

Yes, it is a 2 lb cut of 100% dewaxed shellac in ethyl alcohol (DNA) and it dries quickly. The natural wax in many shellac products is bad, bad, and badder because the wax causes adhesion problems when other finishes/stains are applied over it. Stay away from the shellac finishes at your local BORGs-they are not dewaxed!

http://www.rockler.com/zinsser-bullseye-sealcoat

Splotchy stains. A couple of solutions are 1.) dilute the Zinnser SealCoat 1:1 with DNA and apply it before staining and 2.) use a gel stain with or without shellac pre-treatment.

A few pics of this pretty wood would be useful.
 

sgtdave

New User
Dave
You wanted some pictures. Here you go. The narrow boards on the right of the center photo were really dark when planed. There has been a lot of change in these boards after sitting in hte shop just a couple of days. The lumber in the round shelves was not nearly as "wet" as the others but if you wiped your hand on them and grabbed clothing that scent stayed on them until I put them in the wash.
Bookcase Shelves.JPGTable Rough.JPGDividers.JPG
 

Jeff

New User
Jeff
Thanks for the pics. That sure looks like old growth long leaf pine which, characteristically, has a lot of sap/pitch. Take a look at the pic slideshows and compare them with your wood.

http://www.appalachianwoods.com/flooring/heart_pine_flooring.htm

http://www.heartwoodpine.com

It'd be a shame to stain it or otherwise cover up the natural beauty of this wood so I still recommend shellac or other relatively clear finishes. Your friend may not understand what he has and it's just a "wood is wood" mindset so stain it to look like cherry.

How about building his revolving bookcase out of real cherry wood and save this good stuff for something else?
 

sgtdave

New User
Dave
The book case is a must. Also building a table from this same wood.i do a lot of wood (exotics and ptherwise) in natural and it is my primary way of working. I really believe I can convince him to keep it natural. He is coming by to discuss options tommorrow.

Thanls for your input. Almost everyone is on the same page about this project. I really appreciate the input.
 

AdamO

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I used some old (100 year +) pine barnwood for trim in my house recently. My stuff looked a lot like what you've got in your photos--with the exception of being rougher around the edges. I partially planed it to give a more uniform appearance while still keeping some of the character.

Anyway, I hit it with satin poly, and liked the results. It brought out the grain, darkened some, but didn't hide the color. I've been wiping that stuff on lately, and I like that method as well.
 
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