Do you use spring joints for large panel glue ups?

nn4jw

New User
Jim
I get the FWW emails with videos. Just watched an interesting video with Bob Van Dyke demoing and discussing spring joints for large panel glue ups. I've never used this technique myself being a rank amateur but I'm going to have to try it after watching that video.

I'm just curious how many here use this technique on a regular basis. If you've used it but decided it wasn't for you, what made you decide against it?
 

Michael Mathews

Michael
Corporate Member
I also saw that video Jim! I've never seen this technique. I've always attempted to get two perfectly flat edges then glue them. Interesting for sure!
 

nn4jw

New User
Jim
I also saw that video Jim! I've never seen this technique. I've always attempted to get two perfectly flat edges then glue them. Interesting for sure!

I was especially interested in how, if done properly, you don't have to thickness plane or sand the resulting panel as it's already made up of equal thickness boards. Seems like a great reason for using that technique. No searching for someone with a really wide sander or planing machine.
 

Gofor

Mark
Corporate Member
I have had best luck with clamping one panel on edge, then setting the next on top. I look for light gaps, and fine tune the fit with a plane. When the panel on top sits there solidly by itself without light gaps and is in plane with the bottom panel (I check with a straight edge) its pretty much there. Last check is to gently slide the panel a small amount end to end. If it drags slightly (rub joint) then its as good as I can make it. Note: this only works with flat panels, but using the rub joint technique for gluing (panels still on edge) I have successfully glued up as large as a 4 panel layup (one joint at a time) without using clamps. My two panel glue-ups are usually flat on the bench, with minimal if any clamping pressure.

If one of the board is slightly bowed, I do basically the same thing, but clamp the ends to get them in plane and another at the peak of the bow. This requires tapping the top with a mallet to make sure the edges are seated when doing the light gap check. This also requires clamps for gluing.

Beings I usually cut the panel assembly to final length after glue-up, I would be cutting off the compressed ends, negating the advantages of that method.

All of the above is being said without having viewed the videos referenced in the other thread. After seeing them, I may try it again. My previous attempts at spring joints left something to be desired, so maybe I was doing it wrong.
 

MarkE

Mark
Corporate Member
I'm a bit confused. What is the advantage to this joint?

I understand that it is used to glue up a panel from boards that have already been planed to the wanted thickness and will also be to wide to go through the planers that most of us have. I just don't see how this particular method makes it easier to get perfect alignment between the two board edges. Wouldn't it be just as easy to joint both edges square and flat and maybe use a couple more clamps?
 

nn4jw

New User
Jim
I'm a bit confused. What is the advantage to this joint?

I understand that it is used to glue up a panel from boards that have already been planed to the wanted thickness and will also be to wide to go through the planers that most of us have. I just don't see how this particular method makes it easier to get perfect alignment between the two board edges. Wouldn't it be just as easy to joint both edges square and flat and maybe use a couple more clamps?

Only repeating what I saw in the video - it's just as strong a joint as joining the boards flat with (according to the video) less likelihood of a separation at the ends of the joint (movement). No personal experience here.
 

BioAboreal

New User
Ben
Hey, I'm new to the forums here but need to get 5 posts.

My opinion is this, and I've been involved in the lamination of well over 1000 panels & the glue up process. Granted I didn't glue all these panels but have glued up my fair share, including hardwoods like that require acetone to get the oils off.

Not one of those boards was glued using the technique I saw in the video. Several years later, some of those cutoff panels that I have in the back of my truck, even in the weather have stayed together. Typically the rate of failure with a glue up would be 0-5% at most.
 

Willemjm

Willem
Corporate Member
Did not know the term, but I set up my jointer with the outfeed table level with the cutters. Then I edge joint two 72” (12ft) boards. Put them together and back to the jointer by tweaking the outfeed table height until I get a 1/64” gap in the center between the boards. So I guess I have always done spring joints?

What we do not want is an ever so tiny gap at both ends of the glue-up, as that increases the risk of checking development.
 

mdbuntyn

Matt
Staff member
Corporate Member
From what I've heard/read from other hand tool woodworkers, the main benefit is that, depending on the length of the boards, you only need one clamp for the glue-up.
 

Graywolf

Board of Directors, President
Richard
Staff member
Corporate Member
Yes, I use the spring joint for small panel glue ups as well. Advantages are less clamps makes for faster clamp up, and I can glue up more panels at a time. It can help prevent the ends from separating down the road. And yes, the panels are planed to the same thickness before the glue up and the are as flat as can be achieve. This makes cleaning up the glue joint easier and faster, I’m primarily a hand tool user so I don’t have the wide drum or belt sander. It’s not that I’m against any of that, it’s just what my reality is and I will not let anything hold me back. :cool:. That was a good video.
 

creasman

Jim
Staff member
Corporate Member
Testimonial.

I've glued up a lot of panels over the years. My usual method is to run both edges across my 6" jointer and then place a clamp every 8-10 inches. I make sure I'm doing this on a flat table, alternate the clamps (over and under), and leave it in the clamps overnight.

I have a couple of 10" wide cherry boards that will be a table top so I decided to try this method. I used my Stanely No. 7 to get a perfectly fitting joint, then followed the video using a No 4. so that a piece of paper just fit into the gap in the middle. Sure enough, a single clamp is all you need to bring it together all the way across. This is so much easier than the other way. I also like his suggestion of cleaning up the glue as soon as the clamp is tightened.

A couple of things I recommend:
  • Give the plane irons a fresh edge so they cut smoothly and with little effort. I'd been using mine to flatten the boards. Even though they were still pretty sharp a few minutes on the stone and leather strop was necessary.
  • The position of the center clamp's force is key to getting a flat panel. In the video he recommended centering the screw on the board. When I did this the panel had a slight bulge when checked with a straight edge. I moved the clamp back a quarter inch so that the screw was slightly off-center. When I tightened it again the bulge was gone and I had a flat panel (I have old-style bar clamps that are always a bit fussy, so this was no surprise for me).
Anyway, thanks for sharing. I've learned a new technique.
 

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Willemjm

Willem
Corporate Member
Well shoot. I guess I've been using spring joints for many years. :D
LOL

That looks like a plan for joining only two boards, but normally I join a few together. I use a clamping system though which aligns the boards precise, needing a few card scraper strokes to clean off glue. Means no fiddling, straight from the jointer and glue-up. Trying to do it using the spring joint demo will mean more work for me. Also, if the boards are flat sawn, I stay away from wide boards such as 10” due to seasonal cupping.
 

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