Big discounts on Harvey and Bridge City
- Thread starter tvrgeek
- Start date
They seem to be doing updates to the designs, so what was the old Ambassador C-300 Table Saw ( what I have) is now a different model in the Alpha line with improved features. It was a pretty old design. ( OEM'd to Grizzly as the 690) I did ask them if the blade shroud could be retrofitted, but no, they did change the trunnion a little. I have some ideas on how to retrofit the old machine, but need to pull the table off and that is a big project. I added a SawStop 4" overarm and it helps on some cuts, not others. Dust collection is a matter of focus, not gross CFM.
I actually did not see a reasoning for two lines, but I am much more of engineering that marketing mindset. Quality was the same, just 3 HP pivot trunnion vs. 4 HP dovetail trunnion. I actually wish they just had a 3 HP motor option in the Alpha. I would have gone for that. Power limitations.
The C-14 band saw (I have) remains unchanged. Other than dust collection, I don't know what could be improved. Oh yea, much bigger table! They all need that!
Truth is as always, look at the exploded parts diagram to see which tools across the models and brands are actually the same ones. Then see what bold-ons' are different.
I did forward some suggestions to improve their JointMaster II. Nifty machine for small precision parts but needs a few tweaks.
My Bridge City tools were from the "good old days" of wood and brass. I don't care for their new techno-tools. Maybe better, but just not my thing (or price range) My new try square is from MWTCA meet. Just can't beat the feel of rosewood well oiled and buffed out! You want to pick up the tool and use it. $12
I actually did not see a reasoning for two lines, but I am much more of engineering that marketing mindset. Quality was the same, just 3 HP pivot trunnion vs. 4 HP dovetail trunnion. I actually wish they just had a 3 HP motor option in the Alpha. I would have gone for that. Power limitations.
The C-14 band saw (I have) remains unchanged. Other than dust collection, I don't know what could be improved. Oh yea, much bigger table! They all need that!
Truth is as always, look at the exploded parts diagram to see which tools across the models and brands are actually the same ones. Then see what bold-ons' are different.
I did forward some suggestions to improve their JointMaster II. Nifty machine for small precision parts but needs a few tweaks.
My Bridge City tools were from the "good old days" of wood and brass. I don't care for their new techno-tools. Maybe better, but just not my thing (or price range) My new try square is from MWTCA meet. Just can't beat the feel of rosewood well oiled and buffed out! You want to pick up the tool and use it. $12
I recently got the Harvey Alpha 4 hp table saw. So far I like it but I am finding the dust collection is below my expectations. Mostly it doesn’t capture enough dust off the top. It comes standard with the overhead collection setup but it doesn’t seem to direct enough air flow (suction) through that part of it…either that or the hood design isn’t getting it done. I need to take some time to try to figure it out.
Other than that it’s a solid saw. I love that I can count on the scale to be “dead nuts” on to whatever I set the fence to. The high/low fence feature has proved to be more useful than I thought I would be. Set to low when cutting anything close to the blade and it gives you better visibility and room for a push stick. Just cut through some 2 1/2“ thick white oak like butt’a.
Other than that it’s a solid saw. I love that I can count on the scale to be “dead nuts” on to whatever I set the fence to. The high/low fence feature has proved to be more useful than I thought I would be. Set to low when cutting anything close to the blade and it gives you better visibility and room for a push stick. Just cut through some 2 1/2“ thick white oak like butt’a.
No saw is worth a darn on dust collection. I was doing some edge rips and noticed the dust trail is in a specific path. I am working on a concept of a pop-up port to exactly capture that path. It could also be the idea of a dedicated ZCI with openings in just the right spot, directly connected to vacuum could work, but as by definition for an edge cut, there will be no wood there, so a raised port may work. Now, that the dust shoots off the blade at this angle is a hint for my other concept, that of a wedge very close to the blade under the table. The idea is to use the fan function of the blade to force the dust from the gullets before it is carried back up through the table and work on the back side. Then with focused vacuum, it can be collected. I had also thought about a compressed air stream, but the HP required is too great. This has to follow the blade so it has to be on the movable part of the trunnion. Might be easier on your dovetail trunnion. I am looking at the riving knife mount.
On my band saw, I made a big improvement putting the blade in a very tight slotted tube so a high vacuum is collecting right below the table. Next test is taking the vac exhaust to the open side of the port so hopefully increasing the flow the flow. Focus. I am convinced dust collection is a focus problem.
My SS collector, advertised as 4 inch is actually 3 inch. The hood is not articulated side to side and allows huge gaps that reduce the effective flow from even my 5 HP clear view. More work to be done on it. I also did a test with a vacuum connected to the blade guard on the exit ( people side) of a sled and found it was highly effective.
Basically, it is clear tool makers should consider hiring someone versed in fluid dynamics instead of simple intuition to deal with dust collection. I am but a hack engineer with more understanding from automotive intake and exhaust system text books, but it seems I know more than what is applied to woodworking tools. It is very clear, shroud or not, just putting a hose on a leaky big box does not collect much dust. Actually, a big box to reduce velocity was the earliest dust collector!
Anyway, yea, the bigger and more stable a tool, the more pleasurable. Harvey may still have some work to do, but at least they are thinking and moving forward. Only other saw with a newer feature I like is the new Delta with it's front height crank, but alas, zero support and highly questionable quality. Been thinking what I can do with a flex shaft to retrofit mine. Bevel gears may add too much additional backlash. Or at least any I can afford.
On my band saw, I made a big improvement putting the blade in a very tight slotted tube so a high vacuum is collecting right below the table. Next test is taking the vac exhaust to the open side of the port so hopefully increasing the flow the flow. Focus. I am convinced dust collection is a focus problem.
My SS collector, advertised as 4 inch is actually 3 inch. The hood is not articulated side to side and allows huge gaps that reduce the effective flow from even my 5 HP clear view. More work to be done on it. I also did a test with a vacuum connected to the blade guard on the exit ( people side) of a sled and found it was highly effective.
Basically, it is clear tool makers should consider hiring someone versed in fluid dynamics instead of simple intuition to deal with dust collection. I am but a hack engineer with more understanding from automotive intake and exhaust system text books, but it seems I know more than what is applied to woodworking tools. It is very clear, shroud or not, just putting a hose on a leaky big box does not collect much dust. Actually, a big box to reduce velocity was the earliest dust collector!
Anyway, yea, the bigger and more stable a tool, the more pleasurable. Harvey may still have some work to do, but at least they are thinking and moving forward. Only other saw with a newer feature I like is the new Delta with it's front height crank, but alas, zero support and highly questionable quality. Been thinking what I can do with a flex shaft to retrofit mine. Bevel gears may add too much additional backlash. Or at least any I can afford.
Scott, motorized popped into my head as I was reading this. Maybe something like an auto power window motor which is worm drive and reversible.
I only have experience on my Harvey and an old Craftsman, but I think you are right. I recently got a new Makita orbital sander and am amazed at how well the dust collection is on it. It's a fine example of a tool maker (and I know it's not just Makita) that has made it a priority and came up with a really good design. I remember 20 years ago one of our plant engineers was working with Dynbrade to retrofit an orbital sander with a pad (and sandpaper) with holes in it along with a vacuum hook-up. Now those features are integrated into the design along with a little fan booster... it's pretty much the standard. Perhaps the table saw makers can learn something from these innovations. Hopefully we won't have to wait 20 years.
Thought abut that, but I don't think it could get the fine resolution we want unless it had a pretty good sensor like a DRO. I am sure an Arduino could do it, but that is a way bigger task than I want. Would be slick if you could just dial in a height and angle on a touch pad. Think Nova drill press. Then again, I have a Wixi on my fence and I almost never use it.
Willie, just got the 3M ROS and with the mesh paper, virtually dust free.
I've been eyeballing their router table top and router fence. Harvey's table top is about $399/$400 vs the SawStop's inline router table, which is about $600. Insane!
just like you've mentioned, pricess have been coming down, here and there, and I'm loving it!
Scott, I have the SawStop smaller diameter over arm. I was thinking about upgrading to their 4", like the one you have, but I'm not sure it's worth it. Do you think it is?
I've noticed a lot of dust on edge cuts, and I'd find it hard to believe a larger over arm would help, but what are your thoughts?
Thanks and... keep dropping those prices!
just like you've mentioned, pricess have been coming down, here and there, and I'm loving it!
Scott, I have the SawStop smaller diameter over arm. I was thinking about upgrading to their 4", like the one you have, but I'm not sure it's worth it. Do you think it is?
I've noticed a lot of dust on edge cuts, and I'd find it hard to believe a larger over arm would help, but what are your thoughts?
Thanks and... keep dropping those prices!
Not that sure on the overarm. The basic arm is probably fine, but the hood is a very poor design. I only use it for rips that are wide enough to control from outside the hood. After I finish my master bath ( only one more wall to tile) I will look at modifying the hood. By the time I am done, I doubt much more than the tube will be left.
Biggest dust issue is of course, trimming 1/16 off an edge. Dust shoots back in a jet. I think a better solution is a flex duct and mag base than can sit in the path of the dust. I also have ideas on modifying the airflow below the table to reduce the dust carried in the gullets. Just need time.
I agree with you. From looking at the 4" over arm, their hood does indeed need a lot of improvement.
You are probably right, with regards to edge cuts. I don't think there is a proper solution, unless it is a 1-off design. Even then... Some dust will get past the hood.
Email came in, from Harvey, so thought I'd share.
$1,999 plus ship & tax. For me, it works out to be a hair over $,2,500 for their Alpha bandsaw. I think that's a pretty good deal .. yes?
Anyways, here's their link: Harvey Alpha Bandsaw
$1,999 plus ship & tax. For me, it works out to be a hair over $,2,500 for their Alpha bandsaw. I think that's a pretty good deal .. yes?
Anyways, here's their link: Harvey Alpha Bandsaw
Premier Sponsor
Our Sponsors
LATEST FOR SALE LISTINGS
-
-
Graco 395 FinishPro air assisted airless sprayer for sale
- Started by RobH
- Replies: 1
-
-
-