Best joints for plywood

Im using 3/4 inch baltic birch plywood to make some bookshelves, and I wanted to use joinery instead of pocket screws. I've been looking at different types of rabbets, and wondered if anyone had suggestions on which would be better between: 1) half blind rabbet/lock joint, 2) double rabbet, or 3) overlap rabbet. With these, I want to join the tall side (height) with the wide side if that makes sense.

Im also considering doing a dado for the shelf, but with a lip (almost like tongue and groove) and was curious if that was any "stronger" than just a dado.

If none of these joints are good, I'd love to know what you suggest!
 

Jerry C

New User
Jerry
Dado joints are very easy to make and strong plus they are good at keeping parts aligned. Dowels make strong joints and are pretty easy if you have a good jig. If you just have to get it done in a hurry it is hard to beat screws...pocket screws or screws and plugs.....screw hole plugs can make a good design feature. About 20 years ago I built several bookcases using biscuit joints with glue on all the joining parts...they are still holding up just fine. Wood glue is amazing at holding plywood parts together in just about any direction so whatever you do will probably work structurally.
 

Mike Davis

Mike
Corporate Member
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JohnnyR

John
Corporate Member
Not sure how it would work with just plywood but if you banded the side edges in addition to the front with solid wood you could use sliding dovetails, or at least just "dovetail" the bottom edge of the shelves to lock them in.
 

tvrgeek

Scott
Corporate Member
I find the lock-miter router joint to work very well.

Dovetails to not actually take that long or that much patience. After I gave up with the power tool mess and learned to cut them by hand, they are actually quite easy and quick. But, with modern glues, a broad box joint you can cut on your TS is just as strong. I have used step rebate and dowels as well. Pin nail to aid glue up , ensure square, and drill the holes while all wet. Or you could spline just the same.
 

Rwe2156

DrBob
Senior User
Although you can get a decent glue joint with plywood, but there's a limit and it's not strong enough for what you're doing.

A dado joint is simply a housing joint and has no inherent strength.

Maybe you could get by with a lock miter, if you have the tools and any hair left by the time you get it dialed in.

Not sure what the opposition, but you need some type of fixings, either screws and plugs, dowels, etc. If you just can't stand to have anything showing, even dowels drilled partial distance or eve biscuits would be better.
 

tvrgeek

Scott
Corporate Member
My experience:
Biscuits have NO strength. They help for alignment only. The expensive Festool dominos supposedly do. They are out of my budget so no experience. I like dowels and splines, but it depends on the finish and if you want them visable. If painted, then no issue. Screws really only hold things in place for the glue to dry. They are not very useful in plywood.

Modern glues if correctly used are stronger than the wood. In a glued joint, it is about surface area. Remember, in plywood, the pieces are full of glue to start with.

Yea, dialing in a lock miter can take some effort. I don't have much hair left so nothing to pull out. :)

PS, that reminds me, I probably should sell my biscuit joiner. I was thinking of hanging on as there are some nifty hinges that sit in a surface cut joint but I can install regular square hinges just as well.

To join a shelf to a side, shallow dados have been used for hundreds of years with no problems. A stopped dado makes it look better from the front. Often only the center shelf is fixed and pegs hold all the rest. It being fixed to the back takes all the racking stress. Half lap rebates to join top to side also using nothing better than hide glue. I fond no fault with glued miters using only pins to hold alignment while the clamps/straps/rope hold it together to dry.

It is my belief, dovetails are pretty much obsolete as far as strength considering modern glues, but for fine furniture, they are expected and pleasing to the eye. There have been some WEB objective tests that pretty much have the same conclusion as my subjective experience.

There is the modern knock down hardware where a large head bolt goes into a cross connected threaded plug. Think Ikea. They can be very strong.
 

Jerry C

New User
Jerry
A single biscuit joint may seem to have little strength but projects consist of many joints and components that support each other. I refer you to the Biscuit Joiner Project Book by Jim Stack. The book has plans for a bookcase, dresser, chest of drawers, and many other projects. Most of us probably tend to overbuild and over think most of our projects and and I am guilty as well.
 

Wiley's Woodworks

Wiley
Corporate Member
Not sure how it would work with just plywood but if you banded the side edges in addition to the front with solid wood you could use sliding dovetails, or at least just "dovetail" the bottom edge of the shelves to lock them in.
You don't say how many shelves are in your bookcase, but if there are interior shelves in addition to the top and bottom of the carcass, Johnny is on the right track--sliding dovetails. Think of this joinery as a locking dado. You'll never get any bowing of the vertical sides, and once the glue dries you'll have the same structural integrity and strength in the side pieces as if you never cut into them. You may find the exposed end looks so nice you don't want to cover it up.

If you use sliding dovetails on interior shelves, you will have additional structural strength, which would let you get away with locking miter joints on the 4 carcass corners. Dr. Bob is right: it is hair-pulling work to get the router settings exactly, precisely, perfectly correct for an immaculate miter joint. Develop the patience (or buy some at your pharmacy) to go through multiple practice boards until you get the router bits to perfectly match up. I bought a cheap set of bits on Amazon to find out if I liked this joint for making drawer boxes. I did, so I then purchased the expensive Whiteside bits. The exposed butt joint lines look classy, so you may want to leave them uncovered too.

The end result of this combination is a bookcase with every joint being a locking joint filled with modern wood glue. You could sit on this bookcase, and it won't wiggle or collapse. Just be prepared to take your time and do multiple practice runs on scrap until you get that just-right fit on both joints. When you get temporarily exasperated just remember you asked for it when you made the decision not to use ugly cheap looking pocket screws. This is the difference between cutting boards and making high quality fine furniture.
 

Jerry C

New User
Jerry
Just to play around with biscuits I did a few red kneck tests. I put 3 biscuits in the ends of a 10 inch shelving board 32 inches long. I inserted the board between two vertical boards in a typical shelving arrangement. I stood on the shelving board and the biscuits held my weight with no glue...200 pounds. So biscuits would easily be strong enough to support shelving. On my next experiment I end glued the two vertical shelving boards with three biscuits each to the face of the 32 inch board. I waited 24 hours for the glue to set. I secured the vertical boards on the non biscuit ends with screws to a 2x10. I then used a hydraulic jack set on a set of scales to measure the force required to separate the joints....the force needed to pull the butt joints apart. I maxed out the scales at 200+ pounds... I took the scales out and raised to failure of the butt joints....There was an impressive loud crack when it failed. A lot of the joint tests I have seen on the internet test joint strength by applying force at 90 degrees to the joint. Biscuits do poorly in this regard compared to dominoes or mortise and tenon joints. Never use biscuit joints in a rocking chair! However this weakness of biscuits from racking forces in a bookcase is mitigated by the face frame and back of a book case as well as fixed shelves. I have not use biscuits much lately.....for fine furniture I prefer mortise and tenon, dadoes, and dovetails. When I want it done fast now I use pocket screws. In the past I used biscuits a lot for the fast projects and never had any problems with failure.
 

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